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SearchAndDestroy
Caliph
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Topic: Jesus Walked on Ice? Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 11:16 |
Jesus may have walked on ice? By Jim Loney
MIAMI (Reuters) - The New Testament says that Jesus walked on water, but a Florida university professor believes there could be a less miraculous explanation -- he walked on a floating piece of ice.
Professor Doron Nof also theorized in the early 1990s that Moses's parting of the Red Sea had solid science behind it.
Nof, a professor of oceanography at Florida State University, said on Tuesday that his study found an unusual combination of water and atmospheric conditions in what is now northern Israel could have led to ice formation on the Sea of Galilee.
Nof used records of the Mediterranean Sea's surface temperatures and statistical models to examine the dynamics of the Sea of Galilee, which Israelis know now as Lake Kinneret.
The study found that a period of cooler temperatures in the area between 1,500 and 2,600 years ago could have included the decades in which Jesus lived.
A drop in temperature below freezing could have caused ice thick enough to support a human to form on the surface of the freshwater lake near the western shore, Nof said. It might have been nearly impossible for distant observers to see a piece of floating ice surrounded by water.
Nof said he offered his study -- published in the April edition of the Journal of Paleolimnology -- as a "possible explanation" for Jesus' walk on water.
"If you ask me if I believe someone walked on water, no, I don't," Nof said. "Maybe somebody walked on the ice, I don't know. I believe that something natural was there that explains it."
"We leave to others the question of whether or not our research explains the biblical account."
When he offered his theory 14 years ago that wind and sea conditions could explain the parting of the Red Sea, Nof said he received some hate mail, even though he noted that the idea could support the biblical description of the event.
And as his theory of Jesus' walk on ice began to circulate, he had more hate mail in his e-mail inbox.
"They asked me if I'm going to try next to explain the resurrection," he said. 04/05/06 09:19 Copyright Reuters Ltd. All rights reserved. The information contained In this news report may not be published, broadcast or otherwise distributed without the prior written authority of Reuters Ltd. | http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?idq=/ff/story/000 2/20060405/0922892435.htm
So do you think it's possible? This theory makes it sound like they could have gotten pretty good winters in Israel. Seems kind of weird to think that lakes would freeze over in Israel, then again I don't really know the weather patterns in Israel.
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 11:56 |
First you have to prove Jesus existed. The we will talk on wether he walked on the water or he was actually pruning his marihuanas when his twin brother made a demo of ice skate for the sake of it.
Possible? Sure. Real? Unlikely. I'd rather believe in Dyonisos making the pirates dolphins or in Isis reconstructing her husbands body from the pieces. It's just mythology, you know.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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SearchAndDestroy
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 12:21 |
Jesus could have been a real person and won over people using supposed "miracles", but just being a good magician. We have magicians today who have huge followings, people who claim they can cure cancer without any real treatment or surgery. The list goes on with possibilities on how a man could create a huge following of believers with just a few tricks. Like the people who sold elixers, having someone fake that they couldn't walk and were very ill, give them a sip of this cure all elixer and they are magicly healed.
Jesus could have done all this using the Jewish tales that one day god's son would be sent down to save humanity. Maybe some people saw through his tricks and this could have lead to his execution?
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 13:20 |
Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy
Jesus could have been a real person and won over people using supposed "miracles", but just being a good magician.
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That's the simplest of explanations. The next simple one is that the minds of his followers made it all and the next one is that they made up even charachter. But the mosts serious hypothesis I've found is that he actually existed but what is written in the Gospels is an esotheric translation of his actual deeds. So, when he resucites Lazarus, what he actually does is re-admitting him back into the community of Essenians, of which he was an important leader, as heir of of the lineage of David, etc. Later, as the cult spread beyond the borders of Essenian Judaism, thanks to Jesus' reforms it seems, the meaning of such stories was lost, as they were read literally and not cryptically by the flock of gentiles.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Le Renard
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 13:24 |
If you remember in the story of Jesus walking on water, it was during a storm.
Matthew 14:25-33
25)And ain the fourth watch of the night Jesus went unto them, walking on the sea. 26) 26 And when the disciples saw him walking on the sea, they were troubled, saying, It is a spirit; and they cried out for fear.27) 27 But straightway Jesus spake unto them, saying, Be of good acheer; it is I; be not afraid.28) 28 And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water.29) 29 And he said, Come. And when Peter was come down out of the ship, he walked on the water, to go to Jesus. 30) 30 But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was aafraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, save me. 31) 31 And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little afaith, wherefore didst thou bdoubt? 32) 32 And when they were come into the ship, the wind ceased. 33) 33 Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
So there is no way it was ice
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DukeC
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 13:31 |
Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy
Jesus could have done all this using the Jewish tales that one day god's son would be sent down to save humanity. Maybe some people saw through his tricks and this could have lead to his execution? |
From what I understand of Jesus' death, he was executed for violating Roman laws banning public disturbances during holy festivals.
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Komnenos
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 14:04 |
That's an old story, Jesus' ice-skating skills have been known for a long time:
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Thegeneral
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 15:12 |
Originally posted by Maju
First you have to prove Jesus existed. The we will talk on wether he walked on the water or he was actually pruning his marihuanas when his twin brother made a demo of ice skate for the sake of it.
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I believe we have already confirmed Jesus was a real person.....
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Spartakus
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 15:14 |
It's all a matter of faith.
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996)
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SearchAndDestroy
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 15:23 |
lol, see everyone should be a Hockey Fan!
Le Renard, all it looks like it says is there was a wind. It also was at night, which means temperatures would dip down further if it was winter. Also it would make it harder for them to see any ice at the time of day. It also says Peter went down onto the water, him sinking could have been him falling after a few steps onto it.
From what I understand of Jesus' death, he was executed for violating Roman laws banning public disturbances during holy festivals. |
Didn't a few of the Jewish leaders have resentment for him for awhile?
Maju, I'm not a believer at all. Just want to talk about this theory and the possibility of it if it were to happen in real life. People always dreamed of walking on water, almost as much as flying. It's something seen as divine. So it could have easiliy just have been a story made up, but this theory just explains using the climate of the times to make it a possibility.
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"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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Dark Age
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 15:46 |
Originally posted by Thegeneral
I believe we have already confirmed Jesus was a real person..... |
Well, then, that would make it true, wouldn't it? What's his favorite color?
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ulrich von hutten
Tsar
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 15:59 |
yep ,it was a big problem for mr. jesus all the time, couldn't swim lik everybody else..
kid jesus at lake genezareth:
"mom, i want to swim as well ,bahhh"
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Mira
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 16:06 |
A bit off-topic, but I believe there's always a better way to discuss
such topics without being sarcastic in a way that will offend the
believers of the faith.
You're talking about the "God" of one religion, and the "Prophet" of another.
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 16:08 |
Originally posted by Thegeneral
Originally posted by Maju
First you have to prove Jesus existed. The we will talk on wether he walked on the water or he was actually pruning his marihuanas when his twin brother made a demo of ice skate for the sake of it.
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I believe we have already confirmed Jesus was a real person..... |
You believe wrong. Every discussion I've always been into on that issue ended in: "nothing clear". Christians yes but nothing clear on Jesus. We just assume that he existed but as a likehood - nothing else.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 16:22 |
Originally posted by Mira
A bit off-topic, but I believe there's always a better way to discuss
such topics without being sarcastic in a way that will offend the
believers of the faith.
You're talking about the "God" of one religion, and the "Prophet" of another.
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Maybe Muslims will bother about that. No Christian I know will, not even the most fundamentalist one. The joke isn't even offensive, it's just a joke. How is Muslim sense of humor?
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Mira
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 16:46 |
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by Mira
A bit off-topic, but I believe there's always a better way to discuss
such topics without being sarcastic in a way that will offend the
believers of the faith.
You're talking about the "God" of one religion, and the "Prophet" of another.
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Maybe
Muslims will bother about that. No Christian I know will, not even the
most fundamentalist one. The joke isn't even offensive, it's just a
joke.
How is Muslim sense of humor?
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We haven't ran out of topics yet to joke about religion and Prophets.
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 17:11 |
Originally posted by Mira
Originally posted by Maju
Originally posted by Mira
A bit off-topic, but I believe there's always a better way to discuss
such topics without being sarcastic in a way that will offend the
believers of the faith.
You're talking about the "God" of one religion, and the "Prophet" of another.
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Maybe
Muslims will bother about that. No Christian I know will, not even the
most fundamentalist one. The joke isn't even offensive, it's just a
joke.
How is Muslim sense of humor?
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We haven't ran out of topics yet to joke about religion and Prophets.
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Jokes of this nature are common in Christian culture: on one hand they are trivial enough not to be irrespectful, on the other hand put Jesus (specially as kid) in the same plane as you and me, something valued by Christians, who believe precisely in the "God & Man" nature of Jesus, emphaiszing the humanity and therefore the jokability of Jesus. Most Christians treat Jesus (God) as one of the family, as a closest friend. In this sense the above joke is perfectly fit for Christian mentalities, who would surely feel offended by other sort of mockery.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Thegeneral
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 17:21 |
Actually, Jesus Christ was indeed a real person in history. Whether or not you believe he did miracles id up to what you believe.
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Maju
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 18:24 |
Originally posted by Thegeneral
Actually, Jesus Christ was indeed a real person in history. Whether or not you believe he did miracles id up to what you believe. |
Prove it. The real historicity of Jesus is not confirmed by non-Christian sources. Of course why would non-Christian sources care about that Jesus at all? But still... it's sort of strange that not even Jewish sources mention him, don't you think? I think that he probably existed but that we can't know it because only the Gospels talk baout him, no independent source. This is problematic for a scientific historian.
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NO GOD, NO MASTER!
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Thegeneral
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Posted: 06-Apr-2006 at 19:25 |
Have you ever seen the show "Following in Jesus' Footsteps"? It normally airs around Christmas time (December for you, since you obviously don't celebrate the birthday of someone you believe to not exist). Actually, it will be airing on April 16th 5pm EST on the History Channel. And I have to believe that if he weren't actually part of history, he wouldn't be on the History Channel.
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