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16th Turkish General Election, 2007
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Mortaza View Drop Down
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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: 16th Turkish General Election, 2007
    Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 03:44
by whom should it been owned than? now maybe he can change to owned by fettos and his students.

what about all people who live in Turkey? 100% of Turkey is not Turk. So lets not forget others.
 
Turkey will be more "Americanized" in the following years. Especially those who are conservative will become more comfortable with western ideas, this is what Erdogan going to do. Just like what Ozal or Menderes did.
 
Conservatives at home(Private life, this include job and univercity life too.), liberal at street.(politics.)


Edited by Mortaza - 28-Aug-2007 at 03:49
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Posts: 1270 		  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 12:02
Originally posted by Mortaza

 
Conservatives at home(Private life, this include job and univercity life too.), liberal at street.(politics.)


And liberal-conservatives are at the assembly.


Turkey belongs to people who own it at his/her heart.


Those three are the men of "Demirkırasi". This actually means they are "the men of nation".They had the most votes.

Nation doesn't mind who made her Americanized, illiterated, poor etc.

This is not an elitist point but truth of me. I don't blame the nation for her choices; if she wants demirkirasi, i can't do anything.Wanted to reply in advance.




Edited by Jagatai Khan - 28-Aug-2007 at 14:20
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Posts: 1270 		  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 12:56
Originally posted by Feanor

'We are all brothers, but everyone will speak my language, embrace my identiy and culture, blah blah...'



How should it be?
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Posts: 1869 		  Quote Lmprs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 13:36
I don't think that question needs an answer.
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Posts: 2408 		  Quote DayI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 17:12
Originally posted by Mortaza

by whom should it been owned than? now maybe he can change to owned by fettos and his students.

what about all people who live in Turkey? 100% of Turkey is not Turk. So lets not forget others.


everyone in Turkey is Turkish, if you would know what Turkish does mean according to the laws.

We should change the country's name also according to your logic then, "why Turkey, not only Turks do live in there... Sooo we should change it to...".

I actually dont believe that you believe in some things you say.
Bu mıntıka'nın Dayı'sı
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Posts: 1869 		  Quote Lmprs Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Aug-2007 at 18:08
Originally posted by DayI

everyone in Turkey is Turkish, if you would know what Turkish does mean according to the laws.

Who cares about laws? They were written by human beings just like you and me.

Cultural diversity is richness, not weakness. If Turkish society cannot acknowledge this fact, no problem will be solved.

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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 02:28

I actually dont believe that you believe in some things you say.

I believe it. Infact, I am against that type of nationalism because of Turkey.. Important thing is people, not the name of country or nation.(Both can change at law. Neither of them is sacred.)

If a big minority refuse this name, Lets change it.. It is futile to repeat kurds, that they are Turkish.(I should also add, It is not important what you mean, but Important thing is what they understand.)
 
 
Infact, I dont understand, why we have that type of fetisism.
 
what if our country called as anatolia? what If our people are called as anatolians.(You can find different names too.)
 
will it harm our turkishness? I think no.
 
selcuks and ottomans did not care for Turkish nationalism and look at what they did.
 
We cannot solve our social problems with militaristic mentality.(Noone become less religious or Turk because Army ordered.)
 
why should we postpone our problems instead of solving them. If you have better solution I am ready for it too.
 
But I do not want to hear emtpy slogans. "Ne mutlu turkum diyene", "Turkiye cumhuriyeti ilelebet payidar kalacaktır" "Turkiye laiktir laik kalacaktır." bla bla bla..
 
Because these are lies and they are closing our minds.
 

 
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Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 08:38
There has been some creative thinking going on over here. I wanna play too.
 
Let Turkey lead world in forming a neutral appelation for her land. No more nationalistic monikers! C'mon world. It's not Turkey anymore. No sir. That is too old school. You all can try something new instead as well. So give up India, France, Germany and China and rename yourselves into; The Sub-Continent, Le Cuisine, Gmbh and Peoples Republic of Polution. 
 
Anatolia sounds like a good place to start but it would only alienate those who live in Turkish Thrace. I suggest we go with TrakyaTolya, Trakyadolu or how about Anatrakya (All mothers would love this one. And those named Anna). Better yet we could go back to imperialistic times and call it, 'Gulistan'! The slogan would be, "Come smell our roses. Love Gulistan or live somewhere else!".
 
Remember, it's not the mentality of your citizens that count but the name of your country!


Edited by Seko - 29-Aug-2007 at 09:16
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Mortaza View Drop Down
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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 09:31

Your point? You made good irony but still cannot see your point.

what is your alternatives? (You know, critisizing did not helped baykal.)
 
 
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Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 09:34
Come now Mortaza. I'm only playing by your rules. Changing a country's name and creating fancy slogans.
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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 09:42

Mine is an alternative(I even dont support it, I just give it as an example.) said by one of best pm Turkey ever see.(Ozal.)

You are just playing a game..

Okey, If you dont like it. Show me an alternative..
 
By the way, As I said before, I dont like slogans. Infact I generally find them stupid. So dont accuse me with producing slogans.
 
 
 
 
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Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 10:31
Fine with me. I'll leave this thread alone for the time being, even though some of the alternate country names are not that bad.Approve
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Posts: 1270 		  Quote Jagatai Khan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 11:48
Originally posted by Mortaza

Mine is an alternative(I even dont support it, I just give it as an example.) said by one of best pm Turkey ever see.(Ozal.)



Hh !!


Edited by Jagatai Khan - 29-Aug-2007 at 13:01
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Posts: 1460 		  Quote ArmenianSurvival Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Aug-2007 at 12:38
     Legally I'm sure its written that citizens of Turkey are Turks. Realistically, a citizen of Turkey is not necessarily a Turk, he is simply a citizen of Turkey. Like Hrant Dink used to say "I'm not a Turk, I am an Armenian citizen of Turkey".

     "Turk" connotes an ethnicity/culture, and while most people in Turkey identify with the culture, being a Turk is not their only identity (such as Kurds, Laz, etc). By labeling them only as "Turks", one is denying them their other identity and thus trying to forcefully assimilate them. It is one of those laws which aims to Turkify Anatolia, some other ones are section 301 and the former law which banned Kurdish language and culture.

     Imagine if we said "everyone in Germany is German". Well, there are Turkish citizens of Germany, and if they lived in another country their citizenship will change but they will still be Turkish. So I think its better to call them Turkish instead of German. I'm sure when their German buddies ask them "what are you?" they will not say "I'm German" (because that is obvious since they are speaking in German), but they will say Turkish. Same for the Kurds in Turkey... if they speak Turkish, whats the problem? Let them call themselves Kurds. If a Turk in Germany can call himself a Turk, then a Kurd in Turkey can call himself a Kurd.
Mass Murderers Agree: Gun Control Works!

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Posts: 1914 		  Quote Kapikulu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Sep-2007 at 04:14
Originally posted by Mortaza


what about all people who live in Turkey? 100% of Turkey is not Turk. So lets not forget others.


If you get down to ethnical basis of every single person, there you can't find common data except Adam and Eve.

States are not genetical research institutions.


Edited by Kapikulu - 03-Sep-2007 at 05:47
We gave up your happiness
Your hope would be enough;
we couldn't find neither;
we made up sorrows for ourselves;
we couldn't be consoled;

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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Sep-2007 at 05:25
Who said I get down to ethnical basis. I am talking about ethnicity which is choosen by people themself.
 
If someone call himself as kurd, He is a kurd.
If someone call himself as georgian, He is georgian. ext.
 
So These people live in Turkey too..
 
Turkish ethnicity can be majority of Turkey but absolutely Turks have no right to exclude others from Turkey.Turkey is owned by everybody who live in Turkey.(Not only Turks)
 
Turkiye turklerindir. Just a stupid slogan.
 
 
 
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Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Sep-2007 at 18:14
 
DayI
by whom should it been owned than? now maybe he can change to owned by fettos and his students.
 
Fethullah efendi's motto would be the world will be run by Turks LOL
 
HiddenFace
Turkey will be more "Americanized" in the following years. Especially those who are conservative will become more comfortable with western ideas, this is what Erdogan going to do. Just like what Ozal or Menderes did.
 
I don't think that the average Turk is so "naive" anymore.
 
In contrast, there will be a huge backlash, the public is rapidly loosing faith in the EU and warming to Iran, Central Asia, Muslim world.
There will be a cultural awakening, more conservatist society which doesn't need to try and be something its not in order to "think" they're modern.
 
Mortaza
selcuks and ottomans did not care for Turkish nationalism and look at what they did.
 
Seljuks and Ottomans moved the Oghuz Turk clans to the region of todays Turkey, they made Turkish the official language of the state, they Turkified the entire region in a millenia to such an extent that the name "Turkiye" is a derrivation of "Turchia" which was first given by Europeans.
 
Actions speak louder than words.
 
Its a shame some so-called Ottoman fans have "Murad V" as a role model, the decadent, submissive, weak period of the Ottomans instead of the glorious periods of Ertugrul Bey, Fatih Mehmed II Sultan Han or Suleyman the Magnificent.
 
Mortaza
But I do not want to hear emtpy slogans. "Ne mutlu turkum diyene",
Because these are lies and they are closing our minds.
 
Explain how this is a lie and exactly what is wrong with being "happy" to be a Turk, should you be unhappy...
 
 

 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 03-Sep-2007 at 18:25
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Sep-2007 at 02:25
Explain how this is a lie and exactly what is wrong with being "happy" to be a Turk, should you be unhappy...
 
No. You should not be unhappy.. Turkishness just has no relation with happiness.
 
If you claim, there is a correlation between Turkishness and happiness, just let me know.
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Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Sep-2007 at 09:23
Mortaza
Turkishness just has no relation with happiness.
 
If your unhappy being a Turk it doesn't LOL
 
There is nothing wrong with being happy with what you are, I don't understand why it bothers you so much, its just a phrase man chill out
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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Posts: 3711 		  Quote Mortaza Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Sep-2007 at 09:38
You still did not show me correlation between happiness and Turkishness..
 
did you?
 
 
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