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Radovan Karadzic arrested!!!

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  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Radovan Karadzic arrested!!!
    Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 04:53
This will never happen unfortunately. The scapegoats for everything that happened in Yugoslavia are aready selected-Serbs Thumbs%20Down 
 
All the others are just "innocent victims of the genocide." Another succesful brain wash campaign for the last 20 years. Dead
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  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 07:58
Croatia has powerfull countries behind it, Italy and France made sure that it won the struggle and Pope John Paul II was up to his ear in the conflict on their behalf.
 
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  Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 08:59
Originally posted by Sarmat12

This will never happen unfortunately. The scapegoats for everything that happened in Yugoslavia are aready selected-Serbs Thumbs%20Down 
 
All the others are just "innocent victims of the genocide." Another succesful brain wash campaign for the last 20 years. Dead
 
This is not exactly true. Croats and Bosniaks were also judged a lot. The fact that they got less years in prison is partly explained by the fact that major croatian and bosnian silly guys died before the trial.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:07
Oh please, all Europe was supporting the Serbs. It was when the US jumped in and told the Europeans to fall in like good little vassals (to quote Carter) did the tide turn.
 
JPII was a great man, but I fear he spent a lot of time of temporal matters than is befitting. Wrt to the Croats.
 
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  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:25

I don't think anyone supported Serbs except Russia. Though Russian "support" was absolutely ineffective.

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  Quote Carpathian Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:27
Originally posted by Leonidas

I am at work so dont expect a debate.

Serb forces took over the enclave and killed most of the male population, regardless of age. not looking it up, or i would have photos and numbers.
 
 If your position is going to be based on details and innuendo of specific events your just making smoke screens or blowing smoke, take your pick. The war was conducted in a horrible and brutal way by both sides. fact. leaders and commanders as well as individuals down the command chain share the responsibility of the crimes commited. fact
 
Irrispective of human shields and other tactics used to extract media sympathy, people were willfully raped, murdered and brutalised. Ignoring such events where counter action/orders can be made is also a crime. Its not hard to understand. smoke and mirrors does not change the core charges/facts against the guilty in that war.
 
BTW i am not happy Croatia gets into the EU without a 1 full hand over of all their criminals, which i beleive is not 100% at this point in time; 2 complete rehibiltaion of the krajina serbs with full and protect rights. 'National hero's' or not, slap on the wrists are not appropiate in any case.
 
We'll start with what you said. The Serbs took over and killed most of the male population.
 
Here's a fuller story though very much abriviated.
 
Srebrenica was suppose to be a UN safe zone but instead the rebel bosniaks inside were given weapons by America to which they cunducted a murderous campaign of slaughter against the Serbs. The UN did nothing. Alija kept this provocation up and at the last moment pulled his top commanders out of Srebrenica. Why? As his own cabinet member stated, the America diplomat said that Clinton needed at least 5,000 dead muslims in Srebrenica before he could intervene. Slobodna Bosna confirms this sacrificial lamb tactic himself.
 
So how did it all go down?
 
 
The Serbs sent a small force of some 200 men with a few tanks. Some of the Bosniaks wanted to stay others wanted to go to Tuzla in the north. When the Serbs saw the Bosniaks simply retreating and offering only small resistance they pushed in. Further north of Srebrenica the Bosniaks took many civilians with them, armed whoever could carry weapons and went north through Serb territory. The Serbs and Bosniaks fought and because the Bosniaks gave their superior defensive position they had to run from ambush to ambush being destroyed by the Serbs. The people died in open combat on both sides. It is funny that you mention "most of the male population" when only 2,000 bodies have been found from both sides, from Srebrenica, a town with a population of 40,000. Even the non sense claim of 8,000 wouldn't mean most of the male population.
 
It is also interesting to note that the bosniak force SW of Srebrenica was ordered to stand down and not help the Bosniaks in Srebrenica itself. Again all part of Alija's sympathy tactic.
 
As for your claims that people were raped, murdered, etc, i don't disagree. It happens in all wars. But the fairy tales of these supposed evil war mongering Serbs is complete non sense. The biggest war criminal in Srebrenica is Naser Oric. Sorry but there just isn't proof of 8,000 dead men executed in cold blood the head lines like to read out. It just isn't there.
 
Examples like what you gave about Croatia only shows how deep the corruption lies. There is no middle ground in justice. I'm tired to hear "well all the sides were bad." No, one side was clearly wronged, while another side was put up on a pedastool. You ask for justice from the west concerning Krajina Serbs...i mean no disrespect but this is just childish. How will the Americans and Germans ever admit to Krajina when it was they themselves that provided air cover and logistical support to the Croatians to carry out the SINGLE LARGEST ACT OF ETHNIC CLEANSING IN EUROPE since ww2. Even if the Srebrenica fairy tale the west spins is completely true, tens of Srebrenicas happened to the Serbs in Krajina but nobody gives a damn. We're all too busy to actually read the facts and just go by hear say. It's really disapointing to see people here who have a passion for history to make some of the comments they did on the first page. "hear hear another war criminal caught!"
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  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:27
Originally posted by Anton

This is not exactly true. Croats and Bosniaks were also judged a lot. The fact that they got less years in prison is partly explained by the fact that major croatian and bosnian silly guys died before the trial.
 
Yeah, a couple of people were judged to create at least an impression of "justice." Most of the convicts were Serbs, most of the Croats and Muslims were acquitted.
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  Quote Cezar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:28
Sparten, I have an idea, since you are a professional. Maybe we find some other specialists here and try something:
  1. AE administration appoints honorable mr. Sparten as counselor for the defense of Radovan Karadzic.
  2. AE administration appoints honorable ............................... as prosecutor of Radovan Karadzic
  3. AE administration appoints honorable ............................... as judge for the trial of Radovan Karadzic
  4. AE administration, selects 12 members of the forum to be the jury (these poor guys should agree, tough).
  5. A new thread is open - AE public trial of Radovan Karadzic. Only 1, 2 and three are allowed to post. After two weeks the jury debates and gives a verdict. 
  6. The thread is then opened to all members to post their opinions.
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  Quote Carpathian Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:30
Originally posted by Sparten

Oh please, all Europe was supporting the Serbs. It was when the US jumped in and told the Europeans to fall in like good little vassals (to quote Carter) did the tide turn.
 
JPII was a great man, but I fear he spent a lot of time of temporal matters than is befitting. Wrt to the Croats.
 
 
Really? On what planet? All of europe supported Serbs? I'm still waiting on a reply to my previous points btw. I'm having a hard time to find the faith in your claim of knowledge on the situation...Unhappy
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  Quote Sarmat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:33
I don't think we can find "objective" jury on this forum. Everybody already has his own opinion about the case and it won't change.
Besides, under what rules this trial will operate?
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  Quote Carpathian Wolf Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:37
I'd actually like to do the defense of Radovan.  But perhaps it would be better if there were teams?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:52
[QUOTE=Carpathian Wolf]I'd actually like to do the defense of Radovan.  But perhaps it would be better if there were teams?[/QUOTE
I defend him in a minute if I was offered. The guy I worked with was part of the Milosovich "advisors" that the court appointed. For two three years anyway.
 
 
Of course if the new guy; Bummerst or whatever his name is, who is head prosecutor at the ICTY, is any thing like Del Ponte.............. Karadzic would get off.
 
 
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  Quote Cezar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:57
Originally posted by Sarmat12

I don't think we can find "objective" jury on this forum. Everybody already has his own opinion about the case and it won't change.
Besides, under what rules this trial will operate?
No jury is ever totally objective. The idea is about the two competing lawyers and the judge. That's why I asked for professionals. I think AE has enough people to form a fair jury.
Carpathian, are you a lawyer too?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 09:59
Originally posted by Carpathian Wolf

Originally posted by Sparten

Oh please, all Europe was supporting the Serbs. It was when the US jumped in and told the Europeans to fall in like good little vassals (to quote Carter) did the tide turn.
 
JPII was a great man, but I fear he spent a lot of time of temporal matters than is befitting. Wrt to the Croats.
 
 
Really? On what planet? All of europe supported Serbs? I'm still waiting on a reply to my previous points btw. I'm having a hard time to find the faith in your claim of knowledge on the situation...Unhappy
Before 1994 the european countrys were generally supportive of Serbia (usually in the guise of Yugoslavia).
 
As for the second part, I am i) not interested in whether or not you"have faith" and ii) far too busy to look over my old laptop and notebooks to find the necessary stuff though I have iii) given supporting evidence to back up all my claim which; iv) you have chosen not to believe.
 
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  Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 12:39
Originally posted by Sarmat12

Originally posted by Anton

This is not exactly true. Croats and Bosniaks were also judged a lot. The fact that they got less years in prison is partly explained by the fact that major croatian and bosnian silly guys died before the trial.
 
Yeah, a couple of people were judged to create at least an impression of "justice." Most of the convicts were Serbs, most of the Croats and Muslims were acquitted.
 
Couple is somewhat 30 croats out of 114 with decisions up to 25 years (Dario Kordic), 20 years in (Miroslav Bralo, Vinko Martinovic), 18 years (Mladen Maletinic, Vladimir Santic). Some trials twere transfered to Croatia where many were also judged for many years under  pressure from EU side.
I know, Serbian were stronger but at least partially this can be explained by suggestion given by Yugoslav.
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 13:49
Originally posted by Sparten

Before 1994 the european countrys were generally supportive of Serbia (usually in the guise of Yugoslavia).
After Tito's break with Stalin, west Europeans (apart from the Communist parties) were of course generally supportive of Yugoslavia, just as in the 'seventies they supported the Ceauseca regime in Rumania because it sometimes took an independent line. (Not boycotting the 1984 Olympics for instance impressed lots of people who nrmally paid little attention to politics.
 
But supporting Tito's Yugoslavia cannot be interpreted as supporting Serbia, since as far as 99% of humanity was concerned there was no conflict between Serbia, Croatia and so on, which were assumed to have vanished from history long ago.
 
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  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 14:50
Hello Anton, if there is 30 Croats, and I counted 20 Albanians and Bosniacs, then nearly half those who are under trial are actually non-Serb! so much for Anti-Serbism.
 
As for support for Serbia, well here is a short list of countries which are confirmed to have citizen taking part in Srebrenica:
 
Russia, Ukraine, Greece (her flag was flown there), Bulgaria and Romania. the Dutch opened the way for the Serbs to the enclave. The French sold weapons to them in the first years of the war, under Mitterand who was openly sympathetic to the Serbs. Greece threaned veto against any motion towards Serbia by the Nato. If this wasn't support then what is?
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 14:54
UK was initially the only country which was "anti-Serb" they way some define it.
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  Quote Bankotsu Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 15:02

Karadzic arrest: Belgrade's strange way of getting a pass to the EU

http://en.rian.ru/analysis/20080724/114822310.html

Serbs: The Nation the West Sacrifices
http://en.fondsk.ru/article.php?id=1498

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  Quote Yugoslav Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25-Jul-2008 at 16:47
Originally posted by Anton

Originally posted by Sarmat12

This will never happen unfortunately. The scapegoats for everything that happened in Yugoslavia are aready selected-Serbs Thumbs%20Down 
 
All the others are just "innocent victims of the genocide." Another succesful brain wash campaign for the last 20 years. Dead
 
This is not exactly true. Croats and Bosniaks were also judged a lot. The fact that they got less years in prison is partly explained by the fact that major croatian and bosnian silly guys died before the trial.


In Serbia there is a stupid myth that the CIA poisoned the entire Croat Croat leadership and the Bosnian president so that they wouldn't stand trial. Big%20smile
"I know not with what weapons World War 3 will be fought, but World War 4 will be fought with sticks and stones."
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