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Menippos
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Topic: Why FYROM should not be called "Macedonia" Posted: 25-May-2005 at 20:20 |
Originally posted by Alexander of Macedon
We don't want Thrace ,we want Ethnic Macedonia
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Alexander of Macedon
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Posted: 25-May-2005 at 20:45 |
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eaglecap
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Posted: 25-May-2005 at 23:16 |
Originally posted by Alexander of Macedon
Originally posted by eaglecap
What is this map about- a pipe dream to take back territory you think belongs to your ethnic group. I notice it goes beyond Macedonia and takes in part of thrace, don't forget Eastern Thrace on the Turkish side. You have no claim to these territories and the borders are where they are at so get over it. |
We don't want Thrace ,we want Ethnic Macedonia
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Stop dreaming- you Slavs have no claim and you do not have to chance against Greece to reclaim it. Plus, you might get spanked by the U.S., if you ever attempted to sieze land from the Greeks.
What would your government do with the Greeks if it succeeded in a land grab? The cycle of war would never end because then the Greeks would reclaim it and this could go on for generations. S. Macedonia should simply accept the borders as they are!!
What era is that map from?
Edited by eaglecap
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Menippos
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Posted: 26-May-2005 at 06:23 |
Bah, there is never gonna be a war between Greece and FYROM.
There are higher interests on stake.
Most probably, the issue is gonna go to Hague or Uppsala or UN or
wherever, it's gonna be imposed on both and we will have to live with
whatever they decide.
Of course there will be lots of negotiation, courts, give-and-takes,
talks, dialogues, heated emotions, setbacks, and so on, and definitely
much work for politicians, lobbyists, activists and such, money will be
spent and thousands of work-hours better spent elsewhere.
And there will definitely be an outcome. But I am increasingly convinced that neither side will be satisfied by it.
Why don't we make a Joint state like the Bosnia-Herzegovina or
Serbia-Montenegro and thus increase lands, population and power
altogether? We are eternal neighbours anyway.
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Posted: 26-May-2005 at 09:27 |
Union of FYROM and Greece?
Sounds possible, Menippos. But won't the same difficulties of the process you mention happen?
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strategos
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Posted: 26-May-2005 at 17:10 |
Originally posted by eaglecap
Originally posted by Alexander of Macedon
Originally posted by eaglecap
What is this map about- a pipe dream to take back territory you think belongs to your ethnic group. I notice it goes beyond Macedonia and takes in part of thrace, don't forget Eastern Thrace on the Turkish side. You have no claim to these territories and the borders are where they are at so get over it. |
We don't want Thrace ,we want Ethnic Macedonia
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Stop dreaming- you Slavs have no claim and you do not have to chance against Greece to reclaim it. Plus, you might get spanked by the U.S., if you ever attempted to sieze land from the Greeks.
What would your government do with the Greeks if it succeeded in a land grab? The cycle of war would never end because then the Greeks would reclaim it and this could go on for generations. S. Macedonia should simply accept the borders as they are!!
What era is that map from? |
Its a facist pan-slavic Macedonian map.
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http://theforgotten.org/intro.html
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eaglecap
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Posted: 27-May-2005 at 01:33 |
Originally posted by strategos
Originally posted by eaglecap
Originally posted by Alexander of Macedon
Originally posted by eaglecap
What is this map about- a pipe dream to take back territory you think belongs to your ethnic group. I notice it goes beyond Macedonia and takes in part of thrace, don't forget Eastern Thrace on the Turkish side. You have no claim to these territories and the borders are where they are at so get over it. |
We don't want Thrace ,we want Ethnic Macedonia
| Stop dreaming- you Slavs have no claim and you do not have to chance against Greece to reclaim it. Plus, you might get spanked by the U.S., if you ever attempted to sieze land from the Greeks. What would your government do with the Greeks if it succeeded in a land grab? The cycle of war would never end because then the Greeks would reclaim it and this could go on for generations. S. Macedonia should simply accept the borders as they are!! What era is that map from? |
Its a facist pan-slavic Macedonian map. |
I suppose it makes him feel good to have an identity but I am glad he has no power to act on his ambition or dream. I hope this issue is resolved but both sides have to compromise. I do not see why a name like the Republic of Northern Macedonia could not be used or Slavic Macedonia, after all they are largely of Slavic origin. I am sure they are far from pure Slavic and have other ethnic mixes but claiming to be to direct ancestors of the Macedonians is only a pipe dream, nobody is pure in that area.
Hopefully both sides will set an example to the world and resolve their difference in peace.
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Menippos
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Posted: 27-May-2005 at 06:34 |
I found this written in the Macedonia for the Macedonians Forum:
http://www.network54.com/Forum/195082
in a posting titled: Where are all the Greeks now??
And I quote:
It seems now that this forum is being moderated, and ONLY intelligent,
well thought out arguments are being permitted to be posted, that all
the Greeks suddenly have nothing else to say!!
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have ONLY lies, fallacies and
ethnic slurring to offer to support their LUDICROUS arguments?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have absolutely NO solid facts to offer in order to support their OUTLANDISH claims?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum are products of a
brainwashing campaign that dates back to the formation of their own
artificial state back in 1829?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have nothing constructive to
offer in the way of a solution to this ongoing Greek/Macedonian dispute?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have an aversion to any
culture that is not "Greek" and especially to those cultures that are
Slavic?
I think all of the above statements accurately reflect the reality of
the situation and explain why all of a sudden the Greeks on this forum
have nothing else to say!
You are all sub-human, Monarcho-Fascist degenerates just like your
idiotic bureaucrats who, and I use the term extremely loosely, "lead"
you! If your government continues on its present course with regards to
the Greek/Macedonian dispute, they will do nothing but alienate your
country and people from the rest of Europe, and indeed, the rest of the
world!
The rest of the world has moved on - it's time you degenerate inbreds
did the same! You self-proclaimed "Hellenes" are most certainly NOT
superior to anyone or anything! Get over yourselves! Even the lowly
insects that crawl upon the surface of our world exhibit traits
superior to those which are exhibited by you Greeks!
If it were possible, I would suggest that you all resign from the human
race. You are a disgusting example of what people should NOT be like!
End of quote.
And I ask: Do they deserve and answer?
So immature, so immature...
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eaglecap
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 14:22 |
Originally posted by Menippos
I found this written in <font style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" face="Verdana" size="2">the Macedonia for the Macedonians Forum/FONT]
http://www.network54.com/Forum/195082
in a posting titled: <font face="Verdana" size="3"font face="Verdana" size="2">Where are all the Greeks now??
<span style="font-style: italic; text-decoration: underline;">And I quote:</span>
It seems now that this forum is being moderated, and ONLY intelligent,
well thought out arguments are being permitted to be posted, that all
the Greeks suddenly have nothing else to say!!
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have ONLY lies, fallacies and
ethnic slurring to offer to support their LUDICROUS arguments?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have absolutely NO solid facts to offer in order to support their OUTLANDISH claims?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum are products of a
brainwashing campaign that dates back to the formation of their own
artificial state back in 1829?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have nothing constructive to
offer in the way of a solution to this ongoing Greek/Macedonian dispute?
Could it be that the Greeks on this forum have an aversion to any
culture that is not "Greek" and especially to those cultures that are
Slavic?
I think all of the above statements accurately reflect the reality of
the situation and explain why all of a sudden the Greeks on this forum
have nothing else to say!
You are all sub-human, Monarcho-Fascist degenerates just like your
idiotic bureaucrats who, and I use the term extremely loosely, "lead"
you! If your government continues on its present course with regards to
the Greek/Macedonian dispute, they will do nothing but alienate your
country and people from the rest of Europe, and indeed, the rest of the
world!
The rest of the world has moved on - it's time you degenerate inbreds
did the same! You self-proclaimed "Hellenes" are most certainly NOT
superior to anyone or anything! Get over yourselves! Even the lowly
insects that crawl upon the surface of our world exhibit traits
superior to those which are exhibited by you Greeks!
If it were possible, I would suggest that you all resign from the human
race. You are a disgusting example of what people should NOT be like!
<span style="text-decoration: underline; font-style: italic;">End of quote.</span>
And I ask: Do they deserve and answer?
So immature, so immature...
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Very immature and foolish!! Thank God people like him do not call the shots otherwise the region would be sucked back into the same cycle of war that has plagued the area for centuries.
Here is another crazy debate site:
http://www.network54.com/Forum/22270
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Menippos
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 17:41 |
Originally posted by eaglecap
Very immature and foolish!! Thank God people like him
do not call the shots otherwise the region would be sucked back into
the same cycle of war that has plagued the area for centuries.
Here is another crazy debate site:
http://www.network54.com/Forum/22270 |
Crazy debate? LOL, that is not even a debate. Just crazy.
It looks like 10-yr olds swearing at eachother, on the lines of: "My mom is better than your mom."
People can get really stupid...
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Menippos
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 17:43 |
Originally posted by YAFES
Union of FYROM and Greece?
Sounds possible, Menippos. But won't the same difficulties of the process you mention happen? |
Bah, we'll sort it out, we are both smart people, been neighbours for long time, we know eachoter's habits, we'll be fine.
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strategos
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 20:07 |
Union? I could see if they were a hellenic people, byt they are only slavic, so it wouldnt work out.
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http://theforgotten.org/intro.html
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Menippos
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 21:18 |
Originally posted by strategos
Union? I could see if they were a hellenic people, byt
they are only slavic, so it wouldnt work out. |
Anything can work out, as they say: Where there's a will, there's a way.
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strategos
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Posted: 30-May-2005 at 22:33 |
True, but in this case, theres No will, so theres no way...
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http://theforgotten.org/intro.html
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Menippos
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 04:17 |
Originally posted by strategos
True, but in this case, theres No will, so theres no way... |
With the appropriate cultivation, the will shall grow and when ripe, will be harvested...
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Styrbiorn
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 06:54 |
Originally posted by eaglecap
What era is that map from? |
It's a home-made map. Probably some extremist who has tried to prove his "claims" by showing something that never existed.
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Menippos
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 07:55 |
Originally posted by Styrbiorn
Originally posted by eaglecap
What era is that map from? |
It's a home-made map. Probably some extremist who has tried to
prove his "claims" by showing something that never existed. |
You find me in complete agreement.
But rest assured that we will be seeing much more like that.
I wish there was an "ignore" button....
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eaglecap
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 19:15 |
I was curious because I have studied the history of the Balkans enough that I did not recognize the map and figured it was a fictional propaganda map, wishful thinking.
Borders are where they are at so some FYROM should get over it. Some of them on the Network54 debate forum tried to tell me that my Papoo was a Pontian Turk who came to Greece in 1922 but he was born in E. Thrace in 1895 and so where his parents and so on. He was in America in 1922 so it they're full of baloney.
He was Greek but born in Turkey but of course I do not consider myself an ethnic Turk although many Turks today have Greek blood. Of course my nationality is U.S. but by token of being half Greek and 1/4 German I suppose by ethnicity I am a German/Greek American. The other 1/4 is too mixed to count.
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Menippos
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 19:49 |
If you feel Greek, you are Greek.
This is the basic principle of Greekness.
The walk, the talk, the look or the lineage do not mean diddly if your
stomach doesn't fill up with butterflies every time you hear the Anthem.
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Posted: 31-May-2005 at 20:12 |
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