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Topic: Macuahuitl Posted: 18-Apr-2005 at 22:54 |
what up everybody, this is my first post on the forum and i've been reading some of the stuff that yall post up and its pretty crazy i didn't know that a place like this existed, ne way, i'm looking to make a macuahuitl, for those of you who don't know its a mexica weapon basically like a club lined with razor sharp obsidian. i wanted to make it as authentic as possible so if ne body could point me out into the right direction i'd greatly appreciate it. and also does ne body have ne info on the mexica martial arts. i had a friend who supposedley was familiar with them, how authentic they were i don't know, but i do know he was a crazy ass fighter, he was going to teach me some things but he was murdered april 25th of last year, rip Diablo. all the knowledge he had accumulated came from books and other sources from within the california prison system ie. other inmates. so if ne body could help me out that would be excellent.
tlazocomati
s1
ps. if ne body lives in southern cali Xicano park day is Sat. april 23rd in San Diego hit me back if u need more info.
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vagabond
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 04:40 |
Jalisco Lancer is your man for this kind of information - our resident Native Mexican expert - if he doesn't see this thread in the next few days - send him a PM with your question.
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In the time of your life, live - so that in that wonderous time you shall not add to the misery and sorrow of the world, but shall smile to the infinite delight and mystery of it. (Saroyan)
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 06:57 |
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Paul
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 12:09 |
As to the existence of Aztec martial arts, undoubtably they did exist, they had military academies in the city.
As for learning them now, a few years ago a school set up in Texas run by a Manuel Loranzo who claimed to be teaching 'Yaomachtia' the traditional Aztec martial art. A lot of questions were asked as to where this martial suddenly materialised from, he's seems to have disapeared these days.
Making a Macuahuitl
The wooden club.... The Aztecs carved their wood with copper tools. If you go to a museum you can see the imperfections and marks. Most modern Macuahuitls are machined. If you want to be authentic try 8mm and 12mm wood chisels and nothing else, that's what I use.
Buy some cheap softwood from your local DIY store and practice at least once. It take less than an hour. Then get some Mexican Pine or Oak and do it for real.
Blades.... This is the tricky bit. Knapping isn't easy or quick to learn. When I started I bought a video and a book but only really got going when I went to classes. It really has to be shown to you. Authentic macuahuitl will have knapped blades, however all modern Macuahuitl i've seen don't they have ground blades. Modern Obsidian factories machine grind obsidian to shape and it's cheap to buy. You could get this instead of knapping.
Another choice is flint vs obsidian. At first obsidian sounds glamourous because it's so sharp, however flint is sharp too, sharper than a razor blade. The basic difference is if you intend to use your macuahuitl an obsidian one will break after little use, however after prolonged use I'm still to manage to even slightly damage the blade of a flint one.
Edited by Paul
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Jalisco Lancer
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Posted: 19-Apr-2005 at 18:06 |
Hola Tlacozomatli
What does signature means ? Ozomatli means mokey, but I lost the rest.
Here's a quick summary that I posted few days ago at Hispanic History Forums.
Hopefully you can find it usefully:
http://s9.invisionfree.com/Hispanic_History/index.php?showto pic=48
ps: I have heard time ago about martial arts, but I do believe are more related to the teaching of basic hands free combat and not any elaborated technique. There's no records about martial arts, but there are leaborated documents recording militar training
Edited by Jalisco Lancer
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Posted: 22-Apr-2005 at 11:53 |
mixpanzinco camaradas,
yeah i heard about some guy who was teaching yaomachtia, which was
supposedley the aztec martial arts but he turned out to be a fraud and
he dissapeared. and as for the word "tlazocomati" it means thank
you in nahuatl. hey jalisco lancer u know ne info about the pame
indians of mexico they are from the state of tamaulipas i have pame
blood and i wanted to know a lil history about them.
tlazocomati
s1
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Posted: 22-Apr-2005 at 15:23 |
mixpanzinco, does that mean something like "the sacred place on the clouds"?
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Posted: 22-Apr-2005 at 15:31 |
from what i was taught mixpanzinco ment saludos or greetings, i have a lot of nahuatl vocab if ur interested
s1
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Jalisco Lancer
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Posted: 22-Apr-2005 at 16:35 |
http://www.uv.mx/popularte/ingles/scriptphplen.php?sid=55&le n=In
PAMES
QUERETARO and SAN LUIS POTOSI
It is a native group in danger of extinction, which is not even considered in the population census. Nevertheless, they are one of the few groups who survive from the Chichimecas.
The Pames were a group of hunters and collectors from which Otomangues got part of their culture. They come from the year 2500 BC. After the crossbreeding or toltequizacion of chichimeca and Central American cultures happened, the Pame group was divided. During the Spanish Conquest, they were considered barbarians and got the name of Pami or Pame, which means No and corresponds to the negative these native groups used as a rejection to the Spanish invasion of their territory.
They inhabit a dry and steppe zone, that is why the flora and fauna are desert-like including maguey, cardonal, mezquite, etc. The Pame habitat is usually disperse. The huts in their ranches are tens or hundreds of meters apart from each other. They are in the high parts of the hills so they have to walk long distances to get water from the rivers. Most of the pames are located in the south East part of San Luis Potosi and some others in the North of Queretaro.
Men make the building of houses. A young Pame usually spends some time in his parents house after he gets married. When it is possible, he gets all the necessary materials and builds his hut. It is usually built in the parents solar. Constructions vary in shapes and materials depending on economic possibilities.
Traditional houses are made with regional materials: ditch reed, corn canes, sugar canes, boards of different kinds of wood, reed, bush twigs, palm, etc. Modern constructions are made with adobe and tin or cardboard sheet roofs. The house is formed by just one room, which is used both as bedroom and kitchen. In the inside, the furniture is rustic and simple. They use wooden chairs and tables.
They sleep on petates or cots. The kitchen is formed by a three-stone-fireplace, a metate, a nixtamal mill, comal, clay pots, wood or metal spoons. There are baskets, fiber rope bags and gourd cups hanging from the roof.
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Jalisco Lancer
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Posted: 22-Apr-2005 at 16:35 |
Population 4,350 (1990 census).
Region San Luis Potos, Santa Mara Acapulco.
Alternate names CENTRAL PAME, SANTA MARA ACAPULCO PAME, CHICHIMECA-PAME CENTRAL
Classification Oto-Manguean, Otopamean, Pamean.
Comments Bilingual level estimates for Spanish are 0 10%, 1 70%, 2 15%, 3 5%, 4 .1%, 5 0%. SVO, pitch-accent, short words, affixes. Desert, forest. Mountain slope, deep valleys, limestone. Pastoralists, peasant agriculturalists. 600 to 1,200 meters. Bible portions 1953-1998.
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