Why has Pakistan sometimes considered India?
Printed From: History Community ~ All Empires
Category: Regional History or Period History
Forum Name: History of the South Asian subcontinent
Forum Discription: The Indian sub-continent and South Central Asia
URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=36268
Printed Date: 24-Apr-2024 at 09:04
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Topic: Why has Pakistan sometimes considered India?
Posted By: bigtop
Subject: Why has Pakistan sometimes considered India?
Date Posted: 07-May-2016 at 18:44
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Why has Pakistan historically been part of the South Asian region in politics? This is something I've always wondered. Domestically, the region has been treated like "Turkey" or "Xinjiang", and while it had great dealings with continental culture, it has always been treated as a different ethnicity or race. Indus River The river was given this name by foreigners, and is ultimately descended from the Sanskrit word for "river". India would have never been called "India" prior to the adoption of western naming practices... at the most, it can be equated to the Europe/Asia divide created by the Ancient Greeks. Indus Valley Civilization I will admit that this one will cause controversy, but the civilization was created by those of South Indian (Dravidian) descent - these people are the Native Americans of the region. British Empire The empire included many territories that have been annexed by other geographical entities (UAE, Burma, Malaysia, Singapore, etc) but never included important South Asian territories (Sri Lanka, Maldives, etc) due to British conflicts with other European colonizers. Linguistic and Cultural similarities between North Indians and Pakistanis South Indians are considered to be a "home" ethnic group in India, and while South Indian culture shares a large amount of it's culture with North India, it has very little overlap with Pakistani culture. Pakistanis on the other hand share a great deal of culture with Afghanistan and the Middle East. Similarities such as language and food are negligible, as similarities are shared with East Asians (Bhutan etc) and South East-Asians (between Tamils and Malays/Indonesians). One could argue that South Indians infact share a lot more history and culture with East Asia, as their direct links with South-East Asia were more prominent through their naval based South Indian empires. The economic integration between Pakistan and India is also quite low. Pakistan trades far more with Middle Eastern countries than with India, despite India being on cordial trading terms with Bangladesh and Maldives; Bangladesh is almost identical to Bengal in India. Race and Genetics I've always mistaken Pakistanis for Middle Easterners. Their face shapes are reminiscent of other Middle Easterners. But even genetically, they are treated as a separate ethnic group from North Indians - the halogroups that bind the rest of South Asia together are not shared by Pakistanis, who instead share halogroups with Middle Easterners. I would also add that racism in the South Asian community would also segregate "Pakistanis" into Middle Easterners. The only times I ever see Pakistanis in Indian culture is through the food similarities between North Indians and Pakistanis (Pakistanis pretending to be North Indian) and occasionally in a Bollywood film. I've always found it frustrating that Pakistanis are so often included in South Asia. They should be treated more similarly to Turkey or Xinjiang. |
Replies:
Posted By: Aeoli
Date Posted: 08-May-2016 at 12:09
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I didn't get why you are finding it frustrating Pakistan is some kind of trans-country. It is very normal to me. You can put it South Asia Group or MiddleEast Group. But there is one think which you can't ignoring the reality of Pakistan has characteristicof both group. Pakistan is easy, Afganistan's position is messy, MiddleEast - Central Asia - South Asia    |
Posted By: bigtop
Date Posted: 09-May-2016 at 20:31
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^ The are several trans-countries similar to Pakistan. Several less famous ones in Africa. The most famous are Turkey (inbetween Europe and Middle East) and Xinjiang (inbetween China and Middle East). The problem is that both Xinjiang and Turkey are always considered racially and culturally separate from China and Europe, even if they politically group themselves with China and Europe. Pakistan and Pakistanis still seem to want to be considered as another element of South Asia and India, despite most of this being down to the foreign empires. |
Posted By: Aeoli
Date Posted: 12-May-2016 at 03:40
I think differently. Most of countries are some kind of trans-countries. Greece is trans-country of Eastern Mediterreanean Countries such as Syria-Lebanon-Israel of course Coastal Turkey.
55% percent of Xinjiang is Turkic (Uyghur+Kazakh) and 40% is Han now. You know that don't you.
Cultural & Racial ??? What is your criteria in Cultural Case? About Racial  According to this, it seems India is part of Muslim world in racial case. People in West and East called the Greeks and Greece when they saw them first time. Italians have focused on people in Epir and Persians have focused on people in South-West Anatolia. " https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aristotle - Aristotle was the first to use the name Graeci (Γραικοί) in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meteorology_%28Aristotle%29 - Meteorology , saying that the area about https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dodona - Dodona and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achelous_River - Achelous was inhabited by the Selli and a people formerly called Graeci, but at his time Hellenes. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-2 - [2] From this statement of Aristotle it is asserted that the name of Graeci was at one period widely spread in https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Epirus - Epirus and the western coast of Greece in general, hence it became the one by which the Hellenes were known to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_peoples_of_Italy - Italic peoples on the opposite side of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ionian_Sea - Ionian Sea . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-Smith1-1 - [1] According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hesiod - Hesiod , in his work https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catalogue_of_Women - Catalogue of Women , https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graecus - Graecus was the son of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pandora_II - Pandora and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeus - Zeus ; he gave his name to the people who followed the Hellenic customs, while his brother https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latinus - Latinus gave his name to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latins_%28Italic_tribe%29 - Latins ; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-3 - [3] similarly the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eponymous - eponymous https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellen - Hellen is supposed https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Origin_myth#Founding_myth - to have given his name to the Greeks/Hellenes. In Ethnica, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stephanus_of_Byzantium - Stephanus of Byzantium also states that from Graecus, the son of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thessalus - Thessalus , the Hellenes derived the name of Graeci. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-4 - [4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-Smith2-5 - [5] The name "Yūnān" ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persian_language - Persian : یونان), came through https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Persian_language - Old Persian , during the era of the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achaemenid_Empire - Achaemenid Persian Empire (550-333 BC). Derived from the Old Persian designation "Yauna" for the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ionian_Greeks - Ionian Greeks ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Greek - Ancient Greek : Ἰάονες,iāones), who inhabited the western coast of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asia_Minor - Asia Minor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-6 - [6] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-7 - [7] and were the first Greeks the Persian came in contact with. The term was eventually applied to all the Greeks. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Name_of_Greece#cite_note-8 - [8] Today, the word Yūnān can be found in Persian, Turkish, Azeri, Uzbek, Kurdish, Armenian (as Yūnānistan "land of Yūnān"; -istan "land" in Persian), Arabic, Hebrew, Aramaic, Indian (Hindi), Laz, Pashto, Urdu, Indonesian, Malay." Name Indus is coming from river Indus, so current republic of India should choose different english name. Technically there is no country who can demand right on name india without Pakistan. |
Posted By: balochii
Date Posted: 21-Mar-2018 at 16:10
| lol stupid idiot pakis trying to distance themselves from Indians, only Pashtuns and Baloch are similar to central asians. Punjabi and Sindhis are 100% Indian. You speak Indian language, p |
Posted By: medenaywe
Date Posted: 29-Mar-2018 at 23:14
all you for me are Indians.Sorry if i am wrong. Calm down now your discussion people.Regards.------------- Na"De"Na"J=From Worshiping =Praising God-Compensation=Refund=Tax-Bank=Money=Cash=Coin originated-positioned-suited... Population=People-Mortality=Lethality-Action=Activity=Business=Trade=Culture(Ja) |
Posted By: Arthur-Robin
Date Posted: 30-Mar-2018 at 07:38
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Not been able to research this and other nations properly yet, but from just some knowledge and some sources: Pakistan & Bangladesh were the Muslim parts of India that were separated from India and made a new modern nation decades ago. (I.e. was then mainly only considered a religious difference.) The name was a creation from combination of initials of Punjab, Afghanistan, and Kashmir plus -stan "country", and it also puns on Iranian word pak "pure". Afghanistan is often been part of either Iran or India in history. Jammu & Kashmir disputed/divided between Pakistan and India. Kashmir name comes from Hindu god Kasyapa. Languages of Pakistan are Urdu (Indo-Aryan), Punjabi (Indo-Aryan), Sindhi, Pushtu (Iranian?), Baluchi, Brahui, English. Urdu means "camp" in Turkish and Hindi. Currency: the rupee (of/like India). Religions: Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity. Races: ("Brown":) Irano-Afghan, North Indian. Haplogroup: mainly L Elamo-Dravidian? India/Hindu name supposed to be from Indus river and (Sapta-)Sindhu/Sind "seven rivers" (and Indu "drop"? Though it might possibly be connected with Indra?) The seven rivers of Sind later replaced by five rivers of Punjab "five waters/rivers". (Sindbad the Sailor?) The Indus river is in modern Pakistan, and the Indus Valley civilisation is said to be in Pakistan. Islam is a religion not a race, though historically Muslim invaders/dynasties came from Arabia. (Some sources claim Islam has origins in Indian empire.) So Pakistan could be part of either India or Iran or Arabia or Mongol/Turk or Britain, or be a separate nation as a combination of these in difference to neighbours. Years ago i grouped Pakistan with Iran and Afghanistan, though not so sure now re things like haplogroups etc. ------------- NZ's mandatory fluoridation is not fair because it only forces it on the disadvantaged/some and not on the advantaged/everyone. |
Posted By: PakistaniShield
Date Posted: 07-May-2018 at 16:12
Were you being sarcastic or has your account been compromised? ------------- http://pakhub.info"> 
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Posted By: red clay
Date Posted: 14-May-2018 at 11:48
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This thread was reactivated while I was locked out.
Thread closed ------------- "Arguing with someone who hates you or your ideas, is like playing chess with a pigeon. No matter what move you make, your opponent will walk all over the board and scramble the pieces". Unknown. |