Armenia vs. Azerbaijan
Printed From: History Community ~ All Empires
Category: General History
Forum Name: Modern Warfare
Forum Discription: Military history and miltary science from the ''Cold War'' era onward.
URL: http://www.allempires.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=17499
Printed Date: 29-Apr-2024 at 02:00
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Topic: Armenia vs. Azerbaijan
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Subject: Armenia vs. Azerbaijan
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 11:47
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First, to the admins and moderators:
Please, if you think this topic will end up with "brutal" discussion, then I won't feel "bad" if you close it. Thank You.
Now, I want to ask you a question: What do you think, if there will be a war between those two, who would win? - Without interference of any other country or nation. I, personally will say, of course that my country will win. I have several reasons for it, like for ex. I dont know many about Armenian military but I know about ours, every week TV is talking about our "mighty" army and its "almighty" weapons. So guess, from that point of view, my preference is not so strong. But still, what I can say about Azerbaijan's military, is that our military budget was 660 million dollars for 2006 and it is planned to be 1 000 000 dollars this year. Our population is 8 580 000 this month. I dont know both about Armenia's military budget and population. We have 160 000 men serving in the army. We also have got undeniable corruption in our army - that is obvious. And another thing is, if there will be a war, it most probably will take part in Karabagh which 90 % is mountainous and 70 % of mountains are covered with thick forrest. Winter becomes really snowy and cold there (-20-25 C.). So, those were conditions, and I once again ask u to discuss this only militarily, but not politically.
Thank you. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Replies:
Posted By: Zagros
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 12:12
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We have rules against threads like this, not because of the expected content but because you haven't opened it well. You should at least include your own opinion backed by some sort of source and set the topic off on an appropriate course of discussion.
You have some time to edit your post and make it more informative, if you don't then the thread will be locked. And a word of warning to anyone who takes part, since this is in the military forum, only aspects from the proposed theatre of war may be discussed, nothing political (nationalist/racist) etc. ------------- |
Posted By: Maziar
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 16:05
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Don't be so optimistic Kerimoghlu, i think Iran will help Armenia, the relations between Iran and Azerbayjan are not very well. |
Posted By: xi_tujue
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 16:15
i think Iran will help no one why should Iran? ------------- I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage |
Posted By: Maziar
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 16:45
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Iran has a good relationship with Armenia, since thousends of years. And please see this link. http://www.eurasianet.org/departments/insight/articles/eav072806.shtml - http://www.eurasianet.org/departments/insight/articles/eav072806.shtml |
Posted By: xi_tujue
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 16:48
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hmm I mean does Iran realy want to go to war right now? yes I'm aware of the ancient relationship between armenia and Iran ------------- I rather be a nomadic barbarian than a sedentary savage |
Posted By: Zagros
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 17:09
He said: "Without interference of any other country or nation". It would be appreciated if this topic remained solely within the confines of the thread starter's parameters and excluded external geopolitics because we really have no more patience for another flamewar thread. ------------- |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 17:29
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well im Armenian but im not going to talk out of my mind in my opinion Armenia will win becouse 1. got support of Russia both economicaly and military (all of russian kavkaz Army is in Iran after the things with Georgia). 2. Support of Iran (not man power but at least militarly and economic. 3. Artsakh is considered Armenian heartland we cant lose this 4. the president is from Karabagh i dont think he will want hes home to be in Azeri hands. and i dont think there would be a war until 2020 becouse the russian Army is there until that time. |
Posted By: Guests
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 17:40
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is in Armenia sorry the russian Army |
Posted By: Maziar
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 18:52
Ok, yes you are right. I apologize.  |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 31-Jan-2007 at 19:43
Maybe "you" should beat Karabakh before you get a chance to play with the big dogs 
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Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 03:24
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Azerbaijan Military (~$600mil) has bigger budget from Armenian Milittary ($162mil). ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 03:33
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Azerbaijan airforce is developing but still is inferior to Armenian airforce because Armenian side has 30 Mig29s In 102ed russian military base in Gyumri in Armenia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan_Air_Force - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan_Air_Force
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Air_Force - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Air_Force
------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 03:47
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Armenian Army has 102 T-72 tanks, 72 heavy howitzers and 204 armourd vehicles. their aritillery comprises 225 pieces of 122 mm and larger calibers, including 50 multiple rocket launchers. In addition to an anti-aircraft missile brigade and two regiments armed with 100 anti-aircraft complexes of varius models such as M79 Osa, Krug, S-75, S-125 and some Scud missiles with 8 launchers. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Army - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Army
Azerbaijan Army has 259 battle tanks include 136 T-72 and 123 T-55. 513 armored vehicles include varius BMP 1,2,3 - BMD-1, BMR-1, BTR-60,70,80 and MT-LB. 410 artillery systems, consisting of D-30,20 -- 2A36, 2S1, BM-21, 9A52 , Mt-12 and M-46.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan_Army - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Azerbaijan_Army
So Azerbaijanis Army is almost superior to Armenian Army.
Armenians has better trained troops but Azerbaijanis has more troops so if any war happen between them without any help from outside. in short time armenian can defend themselve and if they use better tactics to push azerbaijanis army in short period of time there is a chance for them. Azerbaijanis has more troops and even more money and human source so if they can manage the war to long term they can almost beat armenians. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:06
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Those are official numbers, sirius, usually taken from wikipedia. I, myself have seen su 27's bought from Ukraine and its ceremony. But they do not mention it. Also, tanks and airforce, both countries cannot have more than 50 fighters and 400 mbt's, it is UNs resolution. Also, Gumru Russian base do not have a right to interference, becouse it is a Russian base. But if u will say me that, they will anyway, then I must add that 5 Turkish generals are already in Baku and training ours. I said, without any kind of help - If u say Armenia will buy arms, from Russia, then that's ok, but if Russia gives it almost for free, then it is an interference and in that case I must mention Turkish help - 15 F 4's are in Nakhchivan, they're in Turkish base, but who says they will sit and wait there while there is heavy fighting. I have mentioned before, please, give us Armenian potential, not just Russian or Iranian help. Also, Mamikon, u think your attitude will make me go crazy? I also did not ask when the war will begin, I asked, who would win. I believe this would probably take plave in Karabakh, Armenians, would u plz, tell us information about Armenian military budget? and population?
I would like to know oppinions some non Azerbaijani/Armenian-s. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:13
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We have got Merkava's too. Hey, I have heard Romania is selling weapons to Armenia. Have u heard? If yes, would be interesting what kind? ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:14
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Total Azerbaijani troops is 387,000 Include active and reserved troops and paramilitaries. Total Armenian troop is 77,610. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:15
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How many Merkava have you got ? they are very good tanks. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:19
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Yes, they are, but they are not 3 or 4, I think we have gor early ones, like M2's. About 6 - 7 ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
, no really. Wow, I thought we have 160 000, so it is 387 000. hmm. Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:25
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You have a total af all active and reserved troops plus paramilitaries of 387,00. Azerbaijani active troop are 72100. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:27
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Oh, then what are the numbers for Armenia? I mean active troops, btw, thanks a lot for the information ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:36
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44610. you are welcome. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_active_troops - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_number_of_active_troops ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:38
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armenian claim they have 60.000 and
azerbaijani claim 120.000 but the ranking chart says something else. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:40
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BTW. kerimoglu are you using flag of azerbaijani separatists of Iran for your avator ? ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:40
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That's right, I told before, there are lots of propaganda, provacation and corruption in Both sides, and generally in most post soviet countries. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:43
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No, I dont even know much about it, I think it is what they call, Guney Azerbaijan Flag, was very interesting. Also, I think this was made in Sattarkhan times, but reall, I dont know a lot about it. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:44
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Maybe it is because of time that this chart has been made 25.07.2006. perhabs on that time all information was the same as chart shows. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:47
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??? Didn't get what u said, sorry, would u please explain again? ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:50
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Perhabs on that time all information was the same as chart shows. 25.07.2006 ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 04:54
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oh, I got it, hmm. I fu want we may open a new topic on Guney Azerbaijan and discuss. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Zagros
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 06:35
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I don't think it is particularly important what kind of weapons a modern army has, the most important thing is how they use them. They must take advantage of defensive positions and stowe their supplies carefully. For example, look at Hezbollah and Israel - Israel had superior everything, but with commitment and a few Toofan or Saeghe ATM courtesy of Iran they stopped the Israelis in their tracks. ------------- |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 10:26
Whats my attitude? Its not like I was lying...in any case, I think its pointless to discuss this war since none of us descendants of Nostradamus and also, I seriously doubt a war is going to take place. By the way, during the Nagorno-Karabakh War, Azerbaijan had 50+ plan es...Karabkh had 2 (one of which they destroyed themselves ). What makes you think, that now, Azeries will win.Also, both sides have many more weapons, which are more advanced. So if another war does start, its going to be much much more destructive...by the way, Azerbaijan has 2 minorities who gave it trouble during the first war.. ------------- |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 10:26
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Oh I got u, I am talking about the case of Azerbaijan attacks Armenia, becouse in reality today, it we who wants to get the land back, and Armenia is the one who wants to keep it, u know. So, if I agree with your point (mostly I do), then Azerbaijan will need more supplies and mnapower, good fighting tactics and technology. And we should not forget that Karabagh is a mauntainous place. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Batu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 13:15
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there a are a significint number of azeri soldiers in İran's army.so the persian support will not be militarily but economical or equipment maybe.Armenia would be supported mostly by Europan countries in my opinion.of course,economically.on the other side,Azeris will be supported by Turkey.both economically and militarily.i always thought that Azeri army is better trained then armenians.becouse most of the Azeri officers are trained in Turkey.in last war,Turkey couldnt gave the military support.( except some volunteery platoons that grey wolves sent). ------------- A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari ) |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 14:06
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Base on topic without any help from outside who win the imaginary war. Btw If Iranian government approve they canl send any kind of help to armenia. No Offence. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 15:23
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How is the military support going to get to Azerbaijan? And why do you think Azeri army is more professional than Armenia? Maybe your officers are being trained in Turkey, but ours are being trained in Greece  Also, the landscape of Karabkh makes it far easier to fight a guerilla war than the landscape of say...Iraq. Which means Azerbaijan will need much more of everything. Also, this is a silly, of course there is going to be intervention. ------------- |
Posted By: Batu
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 15:34
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is it true that armenian officers are trained in Greece? ıghrr,those greeks.they are everywhere :) ------------- A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari ) |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 16:23
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Why do I get the feeling that almost every single Azeri adolescent longs for war? That is so sad....but, I guess with 20 years of constant brainwashing one would not expect anything more. By the way, I just found a documentary by a Czech film group on the oil fields of Azerbaijan... http://hrw.org/iff/2006/ny/films.html#22 - http://hrw.org/iff/2006/ny/films.html#22 scroll down to see the summary ------------- |
Posted By: Jagatai Khan
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 16:41
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The question bothering me for days.Don't relate with topic but I should ask:What is the situation betwen Armenia and Azerbaijan in Karabakh and Hojaly Massacre subjects? Actually it is "Does Azerbaijan struggle to state Karabakh problem and Hojaly to the world?" ------------- |
Posted By: Suren
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 16:57
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please don't start the genocide issue one more time, if so this thread is gonna be closed soon. ------------- Anfører |
Posted By: Jagatai Khan
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 17:23
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Ok.So answer only Karabakh problem.
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Posted By: Zagros
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 18:31
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Karim-oglu was wanting a serious topic discussing the issue that he raised - because it is a fairly sensitive issue that can potentially lead to many undesirable and off-topic subjects I am moderating it very carefully.
I would appreciate if everyone from this point on only discussed the original subject. Many thanks. ------------- |
Posted By: Neoptolemos
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 20:48
(I know this may be only remotely relevant with the subject) ------------- 
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Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 01-Feb-2007 at 21:21
GreeceGreece is Armenia's closest ally in NATO and the two cooporate on multiple issues, thus a number of Armenian officers are trained in Greece every year, and military aid/material assistance has been provided to Armenia. In 2003, the two countries signed a military cooperation accord, under which Greece will increase the number of Armenian servicemen trained at the military and military-medical academies in Athens. In http://www.answers.com/topic/february-2003 - February 2003 , Armenia sent 34 peacekeepers to http://www.answers.com/topic/kosovo - Kosovo where they became part of the Greek contingent. Officials in Yerevan have said the Armenian military plans to substantially increase the size of its peace-keeping detachment and counts on Greek assistance to the efforthttp://www.answers.com/topic/military-of-armenia - http://www.answers.com/topic/military-of-armenia I have read it at others places but this will suffice ------------- |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 04-Feb-2007 at 04:15
 , No Mamikon, u was not lying, and I never say anyone that he lies. U was just ironic to my question, and so ironic that, tried to say Armenia is the worlds strongest nation/country. That is why I warned u about your attitude. Unlike you, I think war is going to happen, sooner or later. And I did not not ask whether it will happen or not. I asked, if it will happen, which side would win and why. I, of course support my side, and I believe that Azerbaijan would win, and I put several arguments in, like our population is almost 4-5 times bigger than yours. Officially, armored vehicles, mbt's and artillery we have is 1.5 times bigger than yours (Sirius gave those information), we have the same ammount and almost the same types of warplanes. You have 102 base in Gumru, which is Russian, but officially they do not have a right to interfior. If u say - yes they will - then I should just add that Azerbaijani government was asked for 10 000 Afghans help, but we refused, which I think was one of the great mistakes of Azerbaijni government. Those two minorities - I dont know what are u talking about. Do u mean Talish's and Lazgi's? No they weren't problem, the problem was the civil war between 3 powers, which at the end two lost and one took the throne.
Anything else?
Oh, u want to say me trained by Greeks, Armenians will fight better??? But this is another topic. ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 04-Feb-2007 at 15:54
Which one of my comments are you referring to. By the way, what makes you think, I implied that Armenia is the world's strongest...thats very silly
Well, what can I say, you believe in war. I choose to believe in peace. But if war does start, I wish you good luck on the field...you and the other 100,000 innocent adolescents whose lives your state is willing to sacrifice, for absolutely nothing. With respect to statistics. Azerbaijan has 3x the population, not 4 o 5. Moreover, 10% of it are minorities (excluding the Armenians). Your army does have more planes, and tanks, and manpower. That really didnt help in the first war.... 10,000 Afgans? where would tou get 10,000 Afghans (btw you are aware that there were 1000 Afghan merceneries fighting in the first war right?) I have read that there was a Talish rebellion in 1993, suppressed by Heydar Aliev. I really find it useless, on debating a war that probably will not take place Especially when we know but a speck of information on the countries involved.
Well, seeing how the Turkish army seems to be most effective fighting women and children, I would place my bet on the Greek army training process, but of course, this too, is up to a debate. By the way, Armenian officers are being trained in Russia too. ------------- |
Posted By: Roberts
Date Posted: 04-Feb-2007 at 16:20
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Wasn't Russia during Karabakh war selling weapons on both sides? I heard something like this - that they sold tanks to Azeris while Anti-tank weapons to Armenians. ------------- |
Posted By: Batu
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 01:09
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Well, seeing how the Turkish army seems to be most effective fighting women and children, I would place my bet on the Greek army training process, but of course, this too, is up to a debate. By the way, Armenian officers are being trained in Russia too. hey what do you mean "Turkish army seems to be most effective fighting women and children".we fought the hardest guerilla\terrorists in the world. ------------- A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari ) |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 02:00
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I mean, seeing how the Turkish army seems to be most effective fighting
women and children, I would place my bet on the Greek army training
process, but of course, this too, is up to a debate. By the way, Armenian officers are being trained in Russia too.
------------- |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 03:16
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Maybe "you" should beat Karabakh before you get a chance to play with the big dogs
- That was what I was referring dear Mamikon.
Armenia is the world's strongest...thats very silly
-No no no, dear mamikon, this is absolutely clever. But I doubt it still, u know. U need to proove it.
Well, what can I say, you believe in war. I choose to believe in peace. But if war does start, I wish you good luck on the field...you and the other 100,000 innocent adolescents whose lives your state is willing to sacrifice, for absolutely nothing.
- Here, dear Mamikon, I would guess u are right. U know, It is life, and everyone should believe in something. Thank you for your comment, U too, have a good luck with your peace, after invading Karabgh. U know, it has nothing to do with war, btw, in my eyes, it is revange. And may be motherland meens "absolutely nothing" for you, but u know, we are TURKS, man, 100 000 is absolutely nothing for us - they are going to be SHAHID for Magnificent Allah and Heroes for our Honor, even if they lose.
With respect to statistics. Azerbaijan has 3x the population, not 4 o 5. Moreover, 10% of it are minorities (excluding the Armenians).
-What does World Fact Book say, is a bit different, u know. May be u want to say, with respect to Armenian Government Statistics. And even 3x is enough for us to win - I think so.
10,000 Afgans? where would tou get 10,000 Afghans (btw you are aware that there were 1000 Afghan merceneries fighting in the first war right?)
-Yes, they only accepted 1000, becouse 10 000 asked for trouphy, and the government refused, but 1000 fought for Jihad, voluntaary.
I have read that there was a Talish rebellion in 1993, suppressed by Heydar Aliev.
-U are right here. And another rebellion took place in Ganja, by Rasul Guliyev. And those 2 rebellions did have a negative influence in war. But do not hhesitate on believing that they will not be problem in next war.
Well, seeing how the Turkish army seems to be most effective fighting women and children, I would place my bet on the Greek army training process, but of course, this too, is up to a debate. By the way, Armenian officers are being trained in Russia too.
-Do not use, please, words and sentences which may touch some feelings of people. This is really dangerous, u know that - better than me. I am telling again, This is not the topic to discuss whether Turkish army is Better or Greek, I am not giving u answer for this, which I believe is the very right thing.
Thank you, Kerimoglu ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: kajdom
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 05:30
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bothside are in the same size. no one win. both armies are crapy. |
Posted By: Kerimoglu
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 06:50
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How cute, thanks dduuuuuuude ------------- History is a farm. Nations are farmers. What they planted before will show what is going to grow tomorrow! |
Posted By: Bulldog
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 08:00
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Maziar
Don't be so optimistic Kerimoghlu, i think Iran will help Armenia, the relations between Iran and Azerbayjan are not very well.
Actually relations between Azerbaycan and Iran have been improving. In addition to this funding of Azeri groups has increased by those who want to see Iran divided. Recently there were huge protests in Tebriz, however, currently there isn't a huge problem right now, unfortunately there are those that want to see this escalate and become a problem for Iran.
Therefore I have to disagree, Iran will not support Iran infact it could face some public pressure to help Azeri's in the current climate.
Although if Iran did help Iran, there could also be the possibility of the U.S using it as a pretext to attack Iran in the name of protecting Azerbaycan from agressers.
In conclusion I don't think Iran will get involved, its an unecessary risk and potential crisis point.
Today Azerbaycan could re-take Karabakh if she wanted however, I think she shall wait. Why? well as every month goes by Azerbaycan becomes strateticall, economically, pollitically and millitary stronger while the opposite is happening to Armenia. B-t-c is complete, the Kars-Tblisi-Baku railway has been signed, Kazak and Turkmen oil and gas extensions have been signed, Sah Deniz project is becomming a reality, the EU wants the go ahead with Nabucco, Israel is interested in Blue Stream etc etc
It's a matter of time before the next battle, there will be a war, Armenia has illegally occupied Azerbaycan land and comitted massacres and humanitarian crimes against her people. Now if Azerbaycan have the capabilities to do so ofcourse they will intervine and it's logical for them to do so taking back what is internationally accepted as their's.
ofcourse nobody knows exactly what would happen but the way things are going, Azerbaycan is a far greater growing power in the Southern Caucaus region. ------------- “What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.” Albert Pine |
Posted By: DayI
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 09:38
Mamikon where you sirious with this underlined comment?  And how effective do you think that Greece army is? Did you saw how Turkish soldiers where teaching Greeks how to use an weapon at a Nato naval expedition? Everythime when a Turkish plane go's up into Aegan see, you hear them screaming "OMG Turks are coming" and knocking the doors of Nato claiming violations of Greek-so-called-12-mile-airspace. ------------- Bu mıntıka'nın Dayı'sı http://imageshack.us - [IMG - http://www.allempires.com/forum/uploads/DayI/2006-03-17_164450_bscap021.jpg - |
Posted By: DayI
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 09:39
------------- Bu mıntıka'nın Dayı'sı http://imageshack.us - [IMG - http://www.allempires.com/forum/uploads/DayI/2006-03-17_164450_bscap021.jpg - |
Posted By: Antioxos
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 09:59
I m generally against military logic but i have to remind you the incident in river Evros that happen in the beginning of 1980 decade with 2 Greek soldiers and a Greek civilian and 3 Turkish soldiers and a Turkish officer the result was 2 dead soldier (1 Greek and 1 Turkish) and 1 dead Turkish officer. As you can see the effectiveness of the Turkish army on this incident was low. |
Posted By: Batu
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 10:09
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that doesnt show effectiveness.1974 is effectiveness.3 soldiers are not an army.probably the other greek soldiers fled anyway.
------------- A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari ) |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 10:16
Thats what happens when a nation sucks the life out of a smaller one in its boundaries for 70 years or so. Of course you are TURKS, 100,000 should be nothing for you (perhaps thats why your state was sending human wavaes composed of 15 years old boys  ). Are you going to be on of those 100,000? Is your brother? your best friend? (or both...)
no comment here... ------------- |
Posted By: mamikon
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 10:23
I was very serious about the underlying comment. That could be due to the fact that I detest the Turkish army, and the precious Gendarmerie. But more importantly, how effective can that army be, if they couldnt beat Kurdish irregulars since 1927...If an army needs to remove 200,000 civillians to catch 1000 rogue fighters, it speaks loads about its effectiveness. As for the Greek army, it did stall German/Italian advance into Russia for 1.5 months. ------------- |
Posted By: Yiannis
Date Posted: 05-Feb-2007 at 10:27
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There was enough war-mongering and insults being thrown around over this thread. I'm particularly negatively surprised that some of the older members of the forum do not seem to have learned much from it.
It is now closed! ------------- The basis of a democratic state is liberty. Aristotle, Politics Those that can give up essential liberty to obtain a temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Benjamin Franklin |
Posted By: Hellios
Date Posted: 08-Feb-2007 at 22:44
Your stupid comment was uncalled for.
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