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Zhong Guo

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The Charioteer View Drop Down
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  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Zhong Guo
    Posted: 19-Feb-2006 at 21:40

I have noticed that some people here say the term "Zhong Guo" is a " modern construct ", while what i learned is different from that assertion.

So i wrote the following

It is obvious, that the term "Zhong Guo"(China) was used long before the establishment of the Han dynasty.

For further reference( which in Chinese), please check the following sites

http://www.artcn.cn/Article/Print.asp?ArticleID=3029

http://www.jschina.com.cn/gb/jschina/2003/24/node8192/node82 24/userobject1ai533323.html

this  bronze vessel belong to the  king Cheng(1042-1021 BC) of western-Zhou dynasty.

The inscription within contain total 122 letters, that  the term "Zhong Guo" first appeared , which is the earliest physical evidence.

The character "Zhong" (literally mean centre) as its a pictograph, symbolize the royal banner (how the character look like in Chinese),

the character "Guo" (literally mean kingdom/state/country) symbolize the royal city/residence of the sovereigns, of the Shang and Zhou Kings.

The term "Zhong Guo" originally only refers to the area which was under direct  control of  the Kings, but eventually came to refer all the vassels/states under the influence of the kingdom, culturally or/and politically.

Sidenote: such an important relic, was almost unintentionally destroyed by the local metal recycle station as its viewed unworthy object, but was fortunately saved by someone.

This is a brocade piece  made to protect ones shoulder parts, unearthed in 1995 at the remains of "NiYa" archaeological site,  todays MinFeng county in XinJiang autonomous region.

This Han dynasty- Jin dynasty period textile has a phrase  "Wu Xing Chu Dong Fang Li Zhong Guo" on both the top and bottom, which reads from the right to left (as this is how ancient Chinese read), translate as "five stars gather-at east favors Zhong Guo/China". The term "Zhong Guo" is clearly identifiable.

 As for the  meaning and purpose of the phrase, the five stars point to the elements of  metal, wood, water, fire, earth, that compose the celestiall body. as early as spring & autumn period, the concept of "five stars" has already developed and was in association with the representation of military and state affairs.
Ancient text from the  Han dynasty,records of royal astronomy- chronology of history has the same mention of such concept  of "five stars"  as well the term "Zhong Guo":
"if the stars  gathered at the east, shining red and bright, favors ZhongGuo/China to use military, otherwise, they gatherd at the west, favors the barbarian, ZhongGuo should not use her military",  in the records of of HanShu(book of Han), a similar description can also be found.

From the character of "Guo" (first character from the bottom left on this brocade piece), one can see the writing form of Guo is different from the "Guo" on that bronze ware of king Cheng of western-Zhou dynasty, as the character  "Guo" during early Zhou hasnt got the square aound it yet, like how  the "Guo" is written on this textile.( which it evolved from the Zhou form)
the character next to Guo's right is "Zhong", symbolize the royal banner
the original form of Guo(without square around it), one can understand its meaning by visualizing it, as one can see the "little square" in the bottom left parts of Zhou period "Guo", it symbolize the platform where the offerings  would be placed for the ancestors, the other parts of the "Guo" symbolize a man offering sacrifice in front of the platform.

Together the two essential parts form the character "Guo". As we know that in ancient times, another term which basically has the same essence of description of the events/activities of  ancestral offering, "SheJi" is term originally mean the ceremonial halls of the royal family to their ancestors, but when one says  that a certain dynasty's "SheJi" is finished, then it effectively means the kingdom/state/country under their rule is finished. For example, in spring & autumn When the king of Wu kingdom captured the capital of  Chu kingdom, he deliberately destroyed the "SheJi" of Chu royals, which symbolized that he has destroyed the kingdom of Chu.
So the connection between the concepts is there.
Which all in all, the term of "Zhong Guo" appeared at least from the early period of Zhou dynasty, consider King Cheng was only the second ruler, and to taken consideration that the evolution of the characters at least must be started during the Shang, let alone from practical to literal meaning, thus its reasonable to assume, that the concept  of "Zhong Guo"may had formed even earlier than King Cheng  of Zhou's era.

Sidenote: This brocade piece belong to the  upper ruling class of NiYa, placed at the top-right side next to the body. Its believed war or social unrest may caused the men there to abandon "NiYa".

So, for me to say the term "Zhong Guo" is a " Modern construct " is ironically a " modern construct " itself.



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babyblue View Drop Down
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  Quote babyblue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Feb-2006 at 07:39
the term "zhong guo" has certainly been around for ages...but the meaning is not quite the same as it is today. As far as i know....it's closer to the "central plain-zhong yuan" notion, which is usually used when talking about something that is non-zhong yuan...e.g: the people around China, as a contrast.
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  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Feb-2006 at 09:04

Originally posted by babyblue

the term "zhong guo" has certainly been around for ages...but the meaning is not quite the same as it is today. As far as i know....it's closer to the "central plain-zhong yuan" notion, which is usually used when talking about something that is non-zhong yuan...e.g: the people around China, as a contrast.

The thread " The Han " from the "Questions & Answers" section has got some disagreement regarding  appearance of the  term "Zhong Guo", if you would check it out. Also i've spoted  some Chinese  in the 'steppe section' saying that it is Qing-period construct, which is wrong also.



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johannes View Drop Down
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  Quote johannes Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Feb-2006 at 08:42

The modern Chinese term for economics o (which in itself is a borrowing from the Japanese who coined the modern concept of "economics" using a classical Chinese term) in ancient times meant something totally different.

So what are you trying to say?

Do you expect the majority of Chinese peasants & urbanites from the Han/Tang/Sung/Yuan/Ming had told the Huns/Shillans/Khitans/Mongolians/Hmong/Vietnamese/Portuguese travellers that they were in "ZH[j]ONG GUO[k]"...????!?!?

 

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  Quote The Charioteer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Feb-2006 at 09:35
Originally posted by johannes

The modern Chinese term for economics o (which in itself is a borrowing from the Japanese who coined the modern concept of "economics" using a classical Chinese term) in ancient times meant something totally different.

So what are you trying to say?

Do you expect the majority of Chinese peasants & urbanites from the Han/Tang/Sung/Yuan/Ming had told the Huns/Shillans/Khitans/Mongolians/Hmong/Vietnamese/Portuguese travellers that they were in "ZH[j]ONG GUO[k]"...????!?!?

 

obviously, you havent read my reply to babyblue in this thread, or you wouldnt bring these irrelevant ideas.

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