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Langauge:Hunic and modern day Magyar (Hun

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Shogun
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  Quote minchickie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Langauge:Hunic and modern day Magyar (Hun
    Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 00:01

 

 

 

Theres many more  on here: http://www.rmki.kfki.hu/~lukacs/DETREHUN.htm

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  Quote erci Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 01:21
Are Hungarians aware of this similarity? I've heard that Uralic Finnic idea is more popular than Hunic, Altaic as there are more Finnish words in Hungarian than just a few Hun.

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"When one hears such music, what can one say, but .... Salieri?"
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  Quote Raider Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 03:15
What are the sources of these Hun words? As much as I know the Hun language is nearly completely unknown.
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  Quote Sharrukin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 04:28
Yes, as far as I know, there is no evidence for the Hunnic language except in the names of Hunnic leaders as recorded by the Greco-Roman historians.
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  Quote minchickie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 05:09
They have to know of it atleast in sound formation. Theres  things stating that Huns were early Turk tribes who also shared the same langauge with modern day Hungarian. But i listed the link.
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  Quote minchickie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Oct-2005 at 05:16

Originally posted by erci

I've heard that Uralic Finnic idea is more popular than Hunic, Altaic as there are more Finnish words in Hungarian than just a few Hun.

 

Hungarian is generally believed to be a member of the  (Ugric languages, a sub-group of the Finno-Ugric language family, which in turn is a branch of the  (A family of Ural-Altaic languages) Uralic languages.
There are various alternative theories about the origins of Hungarian language.

For many years (from 1869), it was matter of dispute whether Hungarian was a Finno-Ugric language, or was more closely related to some  (A subfamily of Altaic languages) Turkic languages, a controversy known as the "Ugric-Turkish war". It is only in the discipline of linguistics that the "victory" of the Finno-Ugrists can be described as more or less complete, due to a lot of evidence from the languages themselves. However, significant evidence in some other sciences, including  (The branch of biology that studies heredity and variation in organisms) genetics and mainly  (The branch of anthropology that studies prehistoric people and their cultures) archeology, still clashes with this theory. Finno-Ugrist scientists explain this phenomenon by stating that the origin of the language is not necessarily equal with the origin of the people, genetically. Thus the language is Finno-Ugric, some scientists say, but according to genetics and anthropology, the Hungarian people show more similarity to others than to the Finns (who are like the Swedes on these criteria): to Germans and Slavs (as some Finno-Ugrists, e.g. I. M. Szab, say), or to the Turks or other peoples (as other scientists, e.g. I. Kiszely, say). The lack of serious direct ( archeological) evidence also leads to the questioning of Finno-Ugric theory time and time again.

 

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  Quote gerik Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2005 at 12:25
Minchickie we have to mention that the finno-ugric theory received two serious blows when   Peter Sra published his book on the origin of the Hungarian language called 'A different way' and when  a new Uigur-English dictionary was published in China in 1993.




"In his book the author adds to the grudgingly accepted list of 265 basic Hungarian-Turkic root words another 1,500 which were believed to be exclusively Finno-Ugrian originally or else of unknown origin." Colliender's Finn-Ugor Dictionary claims that the local Hungarian school exaggerates the number of words of common Hungarian & Finn-Ugor usage and claims that only about 500 words are valid. Indeed the list has been declining even in Hungary over time while words of unknown origin have become quite large (50%).

In this light the amount of "ancient " rather than modern Altaic words in Hungarian have become very substantial and for the first time more than the core Finn-Ugor root words. Part of the problem was that many of these words are no longer commonly used in many modern Altaic languages . Since these are the most basic and inner parts of the language they cannot be explained away as borrowing. This newest revelation undermines the whole idea that the Finno-Ugric languages are independent of the Altaic languages.


Source:
The Hungarian Language,by Fred Hamori
http://users.cwnet.com/millenia/language.htm

Here I have to mentions Stein Aurl (1862-1943),a hungarian in british service, one of the greatest orientalist,who on his first expedition in innermost Asia have discovered ancient ruins in the vecinity of the Silk Road.
His second expedition (1906-1909) lead him into the Tarim basin ,in Dunhuangban he discovered a walled up
library of 6000 scrolls, 3000 hand written pages and 5 boxes of other kind of antiquities which he sent to the British Museum. Due to this he was made knight in England.

He returned the third time in inner Asia in the Tarim basin where he conducted archeological excavations untill 1916 when China ocupied Hsynching, Ordoz and Kansu regions. His main archeological findings were in the cemetery of the former uigur capital Astana(Ilihot or in it's chinese name Gauchong).

In the disclosed 500 graves where buried people alike to people of rpad at the time of conquest,and also burials with horse like in their counterparts in hungary,they used the same type of eye patches for dead as the hungarians of rpad.
I believe-writes Stein Aurl-those people, who came with rpad in Hungary, we can enlist them as turks from innermost Asia.


The Uyghur cemetery at Astana near the Jungar Gate provides the answer to this, revealed by Aurel Stein between 1913 and 1915, with another 1200 graves revealed by the Uyghurs and Chinese in 1986. The people buried here were physiologically the same as the Hungarians who settled in the Carpathian Basin. Also demonstrative is the fact that typically Turanian, Pamirian and Taurid elements that entered the Carpathian Basin via the Hungarians are common only among the Turkic peoples of Central Asia, but occur nowhere else in Europe.

Source:
Hungarian Old Country,by Dr Kiszely Istvn in english at:
http://www.biography.ms/Hungarian_Old_Coun...an_Kiszely.html


"The Early History of the Hungarians" by Dr Kiszely Istvn is available online in hungarian at:
http://istvandr.kiszely.hu/ostortenet/
For those who cope with hungarian.


Edited by gerik
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