Did Basil II deserve the alias Bulgar Slayer?

Originally posted by medenaywe In Byzantine Empire existed 2 classes:Romans(Romei?)=masters and vulgars,class of humble servant.During more than 1600 years,all servants rebellions were described different than social riots,which they were.Therefore it looks like those were some tribes different than those that were consistent part of Empire.Imagine it that Soviet Union,soviets last more than 1600 years,than "nation" soviet would have been created.Here lays translation error:In BYZANTINE word was "vulgaris" and this "v" was beta as we knew in Greek today!After "slavic" alphabet was established,eight/night century,beta was used in slavic as "B"=Buki.And "nation" was virtually created!!!Tadaaa. For Basil II all that were killed in social riots were "vulgaris"/"Bulgaris" cause he belonged to race of masters.Romans did not care about ancient origins of their servants,all of them were servants (simple=vugaris)

The Bulgars Basil II defeated and blinded weren't Byzantinians, let alone Byzantinian low class. They were Bulgars, the army of the independent Bulgarian Kingdom/also called Bulgarian Empire  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Bulgarian_Empire; this episode of his life/in 986/987/ had nothing to do with the civil war against the Anatolian aristocracy Basil was involved in the beginning of his reign /in 978, the rebellion of Skleros, and 989 the rebellion of Phokas/.

I told you in another tread that "Bulgar" doesn't come from "vulgar". The Bulgars came from Central Asia, and brought their name with them, so it's etimology doesn't come from a Greek/Byzantinian word.

Originally posted by medenaywe Yes rebels from Empire after became outlaws could have come from all directions.Don,all your written "sources" were single sided,sources and view of Byzantine Romei only(5%).Attitude of people,vulgars that presented 95% of population,are not there!We do not talk about multi ethnic  composition of "vulgaris". Cause the DNA of all ancient people from period before Rome are still here,also all around the earth.

What are you talking about? I'm not talking about the common people in Byzantium, they weren't the Bulgars who made the Bulgarian Empire. How do you find this "single-sided"? Those are historic facts - the Bulgars came form Central Asia, in 6 century AD. Even a simple goolgling of couple of encyclopedias show that. Those are not Bizantinian sources, the Bulgars were enemies of Byzantium. You are mixing up 2 different notions. "Bulgars" have nothing to do with the ordinary common people of Byzantium. You are mixind up 2 events too - the aristocratic rebellion in Byzantium that Basil II had to feal with is a different event from his war with Bulgaria:

"...The first part of his long reign was dominated by civil war against powerful generals from the Anatolian aristocracy. Following their submission, Basil oversaw the stabilization and expansion of the Byzantine Empire's eastern frontier, and above all, the final and complete subjugation of Bulgaria, the Empire's foremost European foe, after a prolonged struggle. For this he was nicknamed by later authors as "the Bulgar-slayer" (Greek: Βουλγαροκτόνος, Boulgaroktonos), by which he is popularly known...."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basil_II

You see - those are 2 different events.
What is DNA to do with anything? The Bulgars intermarried with the Slavs and Thracians, so now the Bulgarian DNA has:

"...89 Bulgarian man tested!
y hapologroup
E(V13)-24/89
G- 8/89
H-2/89
I1-2/89
I2a-17/89
I2b-3/89
J1-2/89
J2-13/89
L2-1/89
R1a-12/89
R1b-5/89
56 tested for mtDNA!
mt haplogroup
D-1/56
H-25/56
HV-6/56
J-1/56
K-5/56
L2a-1/56
N1b-1/56
R-1/56
T-6/56
U-5-56
W-4/56..."

Paternal Y:
I,  is the oldest European marker;  H is  Mediterranean; G is for Causasus; J 1,2 are Middle Eastern;
L is Central Asian, from the Bulgars that came form there;
R is a complicated one, because it includes the Thracians, Myceneans and Iranians; but it's a Indo-European one

Maternal mtDNA:
H, V, HV are Central Asian, including North Asia
J and T are Middle-Eastern
K is Europe and Western Asia - from the Slavs that the Bulgars intermarried with
R is South, SE and East Asia - from the Bulgars again
W is Russia, Ukraine, Baltic countries and Finland - from the Slavs again.
You can check which DNA marker stands for which place  on this site:
http://www.eupedia.com/europe/origins_haplogroups_europe.shtml#W

So, the DNA profile shows all the groups the modern Bulgarians are made from - the Thracians, the Slavs and the Central-Asiatic Bulgars. Even the Gypsies are there with paternal "H", and the Turks with paternal J 1 and 2 and maternal J and T, the Middle-Eastern ones.

For quantative measurements:

Region/Haplogroup	I1	I2* + I2a	I2b	R1a	R1b	G	J2	J* + J1	E1b1b	T	Q	N	Sample size
Albania	2	12	1.5	9	16	1.5	19.5	2	27.5	1	0	0
Austria	12	6	2	26	23	8	12	0	9	1	0.5	0.5
Belarus	3	18	1	49	10	0	1.5	0	9	1.5	1	5
Belgium	12	3	4.5	4	61	4	4	1	5	1	0.5	0
Bosnia-Herzegovina	2.5	50	0.5	13.5	4	2	6	1	14.5	2.5	0	0
Bulgaria	3	20	1	18	18	1	20	0	16	1	1	0

http://www.eupedia.com/europe/european_y-dna_haplogroups.shtml



Edited by Don Quixote - 28-Aug-2011 at 02:22