Author |
Share Topic Topic Search Topic Options
|
bradcorazon
Janissary
Joined: 04-Feb-2006
Location: United States
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Topic: What was the worlds most important battle Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 03:36 |
Im just curious to hear other people's opinions on this topic. I know that there are a COUNTLESS number of battles that have been fought over the vast spectrum of history. I'm asking which battles were the MOST important and influential in world history.
My opinion is that the Battle of Milvian Bridge was the most important for world history. This was the battle Constantine had around 320 against Maxentius. Constantine claimed to see the vision of the cross in the sky, and at that point converted to Christianity. Christianity eventually became a MASSIVE moving force in Western Civilization, and eventually became the largest religion in the world. Had Constantine lost that war, Christianity might not have grown like it did.
Also, Constantinople served as a very important outpost that prevented the Arabic world from conquering all of Europe in the early Middle ages. The Arab nation was MUCH more powerful in and around 700 than was Europe, and Constantinople served to keep them safe.
Had Constantine lost at Milvian Bridge, none of that would have happened
|
|
Decebal
Arch Duke
Digital Prometheus
Joined: 20-May-2005
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1791
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 14:50 |
While there's no doubt that the battle of Milvian Bridge is very important in the history of mankind, I wouldn't necessarily go as far as to call it the most important. There are some vital aspects that must be considered looking at the importance of a battle, or any event for that matter.
1. The area of the world affected. Though this is slowly changing, history as taught in the Western World is very Euro-centric. In the context of Europe, yes the battle of Milvian Bridge is very important. However, from the standpoint of China, India, Africa, etc., this battle loses much of its significance. For a Chinese, the fact that Europeans are today Christian, Muslim or Pagan is of no great importance.
2. The need for the event. Perhaps the rise of christianity in the Roman empire was inevitable, and the battle of Milvian Bridge was not needed to introduce christanity as the state religion. Who's to say if another event would have prompted the conversion of another emperor later on?
3. Who's to say what other outcomes might have happened if the battle had never take place or had a different outcome? Even an apparently minor battle might have gigantic consequences on the history of mankind, but which are at present poorly understood. The further back in time one goes, the more complex this question becomes.
That being said, I would say that there are important battle in the history of mankind, but no one most significant battle. Please hunt around this section for a topic that has a discussion of the 100 most significant battles in history. We shouldn't repeat ourselves...
|
What is history but a fable agreed upon?
Napoleon Bonaparte
Even if you are a minority of one, the truth is the truth.- Mohandas Gandhi
|
|
Heraclius
Chieftain
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1231
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 06-Feb-2006 at 15:11 |
Very recent, but immensely important to the current state of the world, would be Stalingrad, had this been a crushing German victory instead of a humiliating and ultimately ruinous defeat of the German army then perhaps the war would of gone Hitlers way after all.
I think easily a contender for the most important battle of the 20th century atleast.
|
A tomb now suffices him for whom the world was not enough.
|
|
Guests
Guest
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 12:58 |
if we talk about recent history I just want to add D-Day,
|
|
cebeci
Samurai
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 121
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 15:13 |
fall of constantinopolis, if you deem it a battle, would be one 'cause it closed an age and opened another one
|
history is just a repetation of itself
|
|
Ikki
Chieftain
Guanarteme
Joined: 31-Dec-2004
Location: Spain
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1378
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 15:38 |
Stalingrad and the two sieges of Constantinople by the arabs.
|
|
cebeci
Samurai
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 121
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 15:39 |
but these sieges were inconclusive
|
history is just a repetation of itself
|
|
Ikki
Chieftain
Guanarteme
Joined: 31-Dec-2004
Location: Spain
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1378
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 15:53 |
The empire was saved
|
|
Mila
Tsar
Retired AE Moderator
Joined: 17-Sep-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4030
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 16:00 |
How specific must we be with the definition of battle?
If it can encompass an entire war then WWI and
WWII would probably be the most important modern
examples.
In less recent terms, again from a Eurocentric point
of view, the Ottoman conquest of Europe would
probably be very significant.
If we're talking about specific battles within a larger
war, I would say D-day would be the most important
of both World Wars and either the Ottoman success
at Kosovo or defeat at Vienna would be among the
most important of the Ottoman conquest.
In a more global sense... every region has its battles
that are of supreme importance to the people of that
region. The Balkans has the siege of Sarajevo, the
longest siege in the recorded history of mankind.
Latin America has the Spanish conquest, and on,
and on, and on.
So to find something truly global we'd have to look at
which region has the most effect on the world as a
whole, a which point battles like the American civil
war and the war of independence become far more
important than battles in the Balkans or Latin
America.
|
[IMG]http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/9259/1xw2.jpg">
|
|
Mila
Tsar
Retired AE Moderator
Joined: 17-Sep-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 4030
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 16:07 |
We could also look at the effects of warfare and the
changes it brings to society.
Genghis Khan's battles, Hiroshima and Nagasaki,
all of these sorts of things had a huge impact on
how wars are waged, which certainly has global
implications.
On the softer side, "battles" like that of Ghandi also
have a huge impact - inspiring others around the
world, even people of today like Ibrahim Rugova, to
seek peaceful means.
|
[IMG]http://img272.imageshack.us/img272/9259/1xw2.jpg">
|
|
DukeC
Arch Duke
Joined: 07-Nov-2005
Location: Canada
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1564
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 16:27 |
The battle on the Plains of Abraham(Quebec City) gave Britain control of North America(for a short time anyway).
|
|
cebeci
Samurai
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 121
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 16:36 |
Originally posted by Ikki
The empire was saved |
saved and?
|
history is just a repetation of itself
|
|
Ikki
Chieftain
Guanarteme
Joined: 31-Dec-2004
Location: Spain
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1378
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 16:41 |
And the main muslim line of expansion cutted by centuries, whit the
byzantines defending Italy and stopping the advance into Europe by the
Balkans, very near from the main bases of the muslim expansion.
|
|
cebeci
Samurai
Joined: 05-Jan-2006
Location: Turkey
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 121
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 17:00 |
Originally posted by Ikki
And the main muslim line of expansion cutted by centuries, whit the byzantines defending Italy and stopping the advance into Europe by the Balkans, very near from the main bases of the muslim expansion. |
and later on? the ottomans did exactly what you said
i mean these sieges cannot be included into most important battles since they could not change the world forever but postponed the inevitable
|
history is just a repetation of itself
|
|
Constantine XI
Suspended
Suspended
Joined: 01-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 5711
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 19:27 |
Originally posted by cebeci
Originally posted by Ikki
And the main muslim line of expansion cutted by centuries, whit the byzantines defending Italy and stopping the advance into Europe by the Balkans, very near from the main bases of the muslim expansion. |
and later on? the ottomans did exactly what you said
i mean these sieges cannot be included into most important battles since they could not change the world forever but postponed the inevitable
|
The Byzantine Empire was saved, fought an incredible comeback until the 11th century and then VERY slowly declined until the middle of the 15th century. Had the two earlier sieges succeeded and the Islamic forces had used their control of the Byzantine Empire to attack the rest of Europe, the whole Christian world would have submitted to Islamic conquest. By the time of the 15th century, the rest of Europe was now strong enough to fight off the Islamic conquests on her own. The two earlier sieges were critically decisive.
|
|
BigL
General
Joined: 30-May-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 817
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 20:52 |
If we look from a eurocentric perspective we could say DDay was an important battle.But Kursk was the most important battle of ww2 with stalingrad a close second.
Even though kursk directly affects europe the East is still out of bounds to eurocentric historians or popular western history
|
|
Drunt Ba'adur
Janissary
Joined: 18-Mar-2005
Location: Neutral Zone
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 07-Feb-2006 at 21:45 |
Originally posted by DukeC
The battle on the Plains of Abraham(Quebec City) gave
Britain control of North America(for a short time anyway). |
and that's one of the most important battles in history?
There a lot of important battles, but no one that can be called 'the
most important battle in history'. Probably the battles of WW1 and the
battles of WW2, for what they meant, were the more incredible. So much
death... so much pain
|
|
Ikki
Chieftain
Guanarteme
Joined: 31-Dec-2004
Location: Spain
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1378
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 08-Feb-2006 at 03:14 |
Originally posted by cebeci
Originally posted by Ikki
And the main muslim line of expansion
cutted by centuries, whit the byzantines defending Italy and stopping
the advance into Europe by the Balkans, very near from the main bases
of the muslim expansion. |
and later on? the ottomans did exactly what you said
i mean these sieges cannot be included into most important battles
since they could not change the world forever but postponed the
inevitable |
As Constantine XI say, 800 years before the sucess of the ottomans, the
byzs was fighting against the muslim, without that fight, the western
christians must combat against a strong enemy, not only with the weaks
armies of the spanish arabs or with pirates. Can you imagine the
history with a muslim Italy?
|
|
Otho
Immortal Guard
Joined: 08-Feb-2006
Location: Australia
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 0
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 08-Feb-2006 at 03:55 |
Not the most important battle in world history, but in terms of English
history I think Stamford Bridge gets overshadowed by Hastings. I
still don't know how Harald Hardrada actually lost, and for England it
marked a move away from Nordic ties (Sven/Canute, founding of York,
etc) to, obviously, French and continental European connections.
|
Ignis aurum probat, miseria fortes viros
Qualis artifex pereo
|
|
Heraclius
Chieftain
Joined: 28-Jun-2005
Location: England
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 1231
|
Quote Reply
Posted: 08-Feb-2006 at 07:33 |
Originally posted by cebeci
Originally posted by Ikki
The empire was saved |
saved and?
|
Do you see no relevance in the Arabs not overcoming the only obstacle to them overrunning the Balkans and beyond? Byzantine victory prevented a dramatic change in history, took about 800 years until the empire was finally destroyed and the Turks established themselves in Europe, proper. Had the Arabs achieved what the Ottomans did all those centuries earlier theres no reason to assume the Arabs would of stopped at the Balkans, but just kept on going westward.
|
A tomb now suffices him for whom the world was not enough.
|
|