(Scary Imams and gullable) Muslims versus Denmark (and fascists)

Wow, that's very disheartening, thank you for informing us.

They must have known these jokes are intolerable.  The publishing of these cartoons was deliberate, and was aimed at provoking Muslims.  I guess they didn't think the matter would be internationalized like this. 

These offensive cartoons weren't a joke.  They could have joked about OBL, if all they wanted to joke about was a bearded-man preaching religion in a distorted way, according to them.  That's not freedom of speech.  Can they deny the holocaust and call that freedom of speech?  If they can't mess with the Jews, they shouldn't think they can mess with Muslims, either.

I'm glad my country's boycotting Danish products.

I agree with Sulejman Tihic. I support free speech, and certainly a free press - I think they're both very important. I would still, however, bring charges against these papers using whatever anti-terrorism laws exist. Contributing to terrorism should include provocations from the other side as well.

That said, personally, I won't lose any sleep over it. But I do like the idea the Bosnian government is taking it seriously. A guilty pleasure, I suppose, given Denmark's past comments.

Originally posted by Kalevipoeg Yes, bad moves by the Scandinavian governments

You mean they should have abolished the Freedom of the Press to please some people living on the other side of the planet?

They must have known these jokes are intolerable.

Maybe. But for example, do you know what is ok and not   to joke about here?

Can they deny the holocaust and call that freedom of speech?

Of course you can.



This whole issue has become ridiculous. First off, going against whole nations (and those not even involved - apparently Sweden somehow ended up in it too, its citzen threatened to leave Palestine for example) because of a single newspaper is a farce that shows the political maturity in some areas. It is exactly the same as if the USA would gain the right to nuke every Muslim country from Morocco to Indonesia because a few Muslims was behind the September 11 atrocity.


Secondly, the original caricatures were published in a single newspaper several months ago, and they weren't especially dramatic either. According to the newspaper, it was to 'test the boundaries of expression of Islam' - domestically. Personally, I think it was unnecessary, considering the already strained relations with Muslims within the country as well as internationally. One thing you should now though, is that the editors didn't have any idea whatsoever how important these things are to Muslims - here, you can make jokes about anything, eg a Danish Christian would just laugh at similar caricatures about Jesus (and believe me, MUCH worse things are made about Christians). I do not think Jyllandsposten actually intended to insult anyone - which they have already stated.


Lastly, the mess didn't start until recently, when some nutjob Danish imams decided to fuel the West-Muslim antagonism by going around the Middle East telling everyone how the Danes insulted all Muslims. It was one problem though, the original pictures weren't nearly provocative enough, so they made and added many themselves(among others showing Muhammed as a terrorist, pedophile etc*), claiming they too were made and published by the newspaper.


*) shouldn't that make the imams guilty of this as well? I mean, the Muslim crime of making pics of Muhammed.



BTW, here are the pics, I'll link them, since I suppose some of you doen't want to see them:
ALL pics from the Danish and Norwegian newspapers

The pics the imams added to fuel anti-Danish sentiments

So now when there's a dispute like this, they always hold a sort of ceremony. The government takes down that particular country's flag, in full uniforms, with a ceremony. Folds it nicely, and puts it in safe storage until the dispute is over. I like that a lot better.

One step in the right direction For comparison, despite that the Scandinavian citizens in Palestine (almost all being aid workers and UN observers) have been threatened to death unless they leave, the Scandinavian nations will continue to pay huge economic aids to Palestine, whose economy to quite a large part is dependent on such aid. Right now, due to the responses from some people here, part of me think we should scrap it all and let them make do themselves, but hopefully this mess can be settled. Some unknowing newspaper and a few imams who want to spread resentment and hatred shouldn't be allowed to cause so much harm.

Edited by Styrbiorn

I haven't actually read the papers in question, but as far as I know, those are all. Maybe you'll find some of those you have seen in the second link?

edit: I can't spell tonight.

Edited by Styrbiorn

Yes, I found a couple of the cartoons I'd seen among
those the Imam's faked - most notably the one with
the dog.

Well that's just perverted - self-descecration.

I hope Scandinavia will push and continue to push
until the whole story is known internationally.

I hope the paper will be forced to publish a full
explanation, not necessarily an apology, but an
explanation - to be printed in papers across the
Muslim world. Perhaps the paper should also be
fined and the cartoonist and editor should be made
away of the harm they've caused - possibly with
contributing to terrorism charges, even just
mentioning such in the media without actually going
through with it.

And the Imams, they should be forced to do the
same things in regard to the pictures they
themselves made - especially the written
explanation for Muslim newspapers.

Then they should be charged with whatever way you
get them for lying in this regard, and any available
contributing to terrorism charges should be laid.

I still support the boycott of Danish goods because
I'm weary of the intentions behind these cartoons,
especially given the level of public acceptance for
anti-Muslim hate speech in the country. But that's it.

Is it so hard to say sorry? 

i dont think any "imams" were involved in this, the first time these pictures were published the Arab league issued a statment to Danish governement to explain it. they were waiting answers from the Danish Governemnt and nothing was recieved.

then this month a magazine based in Norway re-published those which made Saudi Arabia withdrawing its Ambassador in Denmark to show protest and disappointment of the Government actions toward the issue.

now the people, at the first time these were published people didnt know that because the Governments through the Arab Leagu was keeping it quite and tried to solve the problem with Denmark's government.

so majority of the people didnt know anything about that.

now after the second time the other magazine published them and Saudi Arabia showing its disappointment by withdrawing its ambassador more people knew about the issue and people decided to boycott Danish product to show their protest against Denmark's news paper.

----

i think the matter went from bad to worse when the Danish government explained that as "freedom of Speach" and defended that,

even thought i think it went from "freedom of speach" to Hatred and Racisim propaganda.

the difference is the first is legal and the second isnt.

 

well i'll tell you something NO pictures were shown anywhere in the news nor the Tvs here. its not allowed to be shown nor published. not even by AlJazira tv.

people will protest against anybody publish them here in the middle east.

so people like my father didnt see those pictures not even one, what people here heared is that Denmark and Norway dared and insulted the Prophet and their government approved that. << this mostly what majority of the people knew.

iam here and i know what is happening.

 

Another question, maybe OT but anyway,

I read from everyone says "have respect to religions" why should i respect all another people's ideologies?  I don't insult or offend them, but i don't want to respect them.

I dislike communism, i respect communists as humans and i don't want to respect the communism as an ideology, should i? the same thing with Religions or capitalism or whatever. I don't want to respect them and i think it is my sovereign right, could you respect fascism or nazism?

Edited by Maziar