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Topic ClosedWild Dog vs Bengal tiger

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J.A.W. View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Wild Dog vs Bengal tiger
    Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 18:10
Hyenas cannot reach out with hard-striking sharp ripping claws..

Have you ever seen African wild dogs confront a lion like that, P?

They are generally fearful of them, since they are on a hiding to nothing by attempting such a contest..

I reiterate, how long will a d'hole pack last - if it habitually
loses up to 1/2 of its membership - in attacking a single tiger?

It just does not add up..
So, I must concur with "unlikely" - as reckoned by naturalist in the field, 'K'..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 18:21
Lions are not solitary, how many times would that have to be told to you? Heres some tangible evidence that wipes out more than half your arguments:
 
A single leopard can kill a tiger, even the biggest of tigers, with only one jaw in play (killing him sometimes with a single bite), the wild dogs will have 20-30 jaws in play (which will be constant and accumilated through out the fight)...as most of the accounts are now strengthend, as they start off with, dhole often tree leopards and tigers, and sometimes cases have been known to kill tigers. Theres not one case or two, there are literally hundreds...to me thats more than a plausible an credible means of accepting the posibility, topped in by how much videos show how formidable they are against, leopards, hyenas and other predators, tigers are no exception.
 
Why didnt the leopard just butcher the dhole like you suggested many times the claws would? Because big cats (excluding lions) are solitary and dont have premptive striking and killing tactics when it comes to being out-numberd offensively, nothing you have ever brought suggest they do, they are more defensive than offensive, just being defensive is not going to be any argument for the tiger to win,as he has a limitation to his stamina and endurance.


Edited by Prime - 16-Jun-2015 at 18:28
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 18:40
Male lions ejected from prides at reaching sexual maturity may live solitary, nomadic lives, & yet they do not fear dogs..

& all cats are enigmatic creatures, with a wide range of potential behaviours, depending on their individual character, mood & motive drives.

The video you linked did not show much P, maybe the leopard was up the tree on other business? Or to avoid the humans? No actual conflict though.. certainly nothing proof-wise of a mass killing frenzy,
as the grisly old jungle fables/fallacies supposedly relate..

Have a look at the youtube vid 'Tiger Kills Dog' to see just how quickly this really happens..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 19:03

Then why did the leopard leap down and kill the wild dogs, only two of them, no? Not 30, and again more arguments that contradict the main point, 20+ wild dogs can kill a tiger, not 1. And those hyenas would still see to the collective system of lions, do you have any proof that shows hyenas are brain dead in memory? They would still remember that lions are in prides, wheather one is ousted or alone as well, unless in a form of distress or wounded and alone, just being alone is not gona make them forget lions as a species are not in collective groups who aid each other, and they do attack the females, even when there are 10+ of them, which further exploits your arguments of claws will sheith them from being bitten from any angle.

Guess this one is fake too then:
 
 
- Wild dogs cannot kill animals as big as a tiger (even though sambar out weigh tigers two folds)
- Tigers have infinite stamina (even though the heat alone can kill them, no fight needed)
- Tigers cannot even be nipped because of 360 paw swiping (even though no proof of that exist nor 180 turning constantly for over just 10 minutes)
- Wild dogs cannot bypass claws of big cats (even though it shows right there a leopard being killed)
- The records are all fake (even though biologist, naturalist, eye-witnesses, ecologist native and hunters all agree against you)
- The 5 dholes injuring the tiger is fake hocus pocus witch doctoring fables by anicent romans written in stone (even though you refuse to email them)
 
Your contradictions: 1.) No matter what will be said of the dholes superior numbers you will link or mention single dogs being killed by big cats (not what the subject is about). 2.) No matter what is said about lions being true pack/pride animals, you will use them as a comparison just because they are cats too (not what any other cat can attain mentally or physically).
 
What less than 10 wild dogs can do to a leopard:
 
20+ would no dought do to a tiger. The prime male lions are nearly immune to being attacked because of their social system, regardless if one is alone for a time being, they're attitudes hardly change, and they're manes dont dissapear either...on average this is why the lion is not attempted when alone, unless by extreme conditions, weak, sickly, old, dying ect...as for tigers, even if its in his prime, they lack the attitude, the mane and the social system.


Edited by Prime - 16-Jun-2015 at 19:20
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 19:46
Again, no actual unequivocal proof exists to confirm the d'hole legends, just admit it P..

In the African links, we don't know if the dead leopard was already injured or otherwise infirm too, as seems probable/likely, & in the 'fleas' video the dog yelps from surprise/fear/a strike? & also 'fleas' - when confronted by the leopard.
Perhaps the cat was more concerned about the rowdy people than the dogs anyhow..

Are then any 'stories' of d'hole packs vs Asiatic lions?

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 20:01
I dont have to admit anything, you act as if I am in a academic review giving a speech in front of wild life conservationlist...I'm on no timer, neither is not having any tangible evidence reason to dispute anything...again, do you have a video of hyenas tearing a leopard apart? No, and that doesnt dispute they cant, and dont.  The only person who should be admitting something is you, you have no arguments against stamina/endurance issues nor proof they can fight at all angles without being nipped just once. Perhaps, and then again, perhaps not, the humans werent the ones chasing the leopard, nor was the leopard transfixed on the humans. In your case the dog did yelp...did he blow up into a million peices because of it? No, hence the weapons of claws and fangs are more superficial than you made them out to be, espeacially against so many at once.
 
Its no biggie, I am not losing any cred in this department, I am just sharing what most people wont know...again, not tryna make any one convert over, just letting them know some detailed facts with some from eyewitnessers involved too, like the one  detailed account given of a whole fight on page one, not a already dead tiger being eaten. The book was not in the fictional section, nor the novel section, it was a biological one...via science. You can email the 5 dhole ones when ever you feel the need to prove your self wrong.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 20:23
Hang on P,
Lets get a few things straight here..
..that book is described as 'passionate' not 'cooly scientific'..
& as for the '5 dogs', so-called Indian 'news' story, the tiger wasn't even "torn to shreds"..

I am not doubting for the sake of being oppositional, just on
the bounds of feasibility..

The fear shown by dogs when one of their kind is literally screaming its
last breath out in the jaws of a large cat is palpable..

So, you reckon d'holes as such, are profoundly fierce & untypical dogs, so will typically react savagely to this event - causing them to redouble their efforts, rushing in regardless to emulate their expired pack-mate - in a frenzied kamikaze-like assault.. but this is, of course, properly belongs in the realms of fantasy/fiction, - being in reality, most "unlikely"..

Simply implausible..
& remains to this day - unsupported by genuine, validated evidence..   
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 20:48

You are the one alibing them as bull rushing in attacking tigers (I am saying they would defend them selves), you are the one stateing they are kamikaze dogs, (I am saying they would defend themselves), you are the ones saying these dogs go out looking for war, looking to be pesty piranahs and devour anything in their way, (I am saying they would defend them selves againt a attaking tiger with the empowerment of more than 20 jaws that can tear flesh).

You dont need a science lab coat with a bunch of smoking colored water jars to be deemd science, science just means knowledge, hence these people are eye witnessers to the event, whats more knowledgeable than that? Did you miss the part they had to treat the tiger? isnt it tiger 101 for any biologist, ecologist and zoologist to know that a injured tiger has a massive chance of not surviving? I thought you would know that since you act as if you have a Ph.d on subject. Followed up by, didnt a single rabies dog manage to bite a tiger recently? Now how in gods green earth did that ever happen, what happened to the tigers superman speed that was suppose to cancel out 30 wild dogs snapping jaws let alone one? What happen to the titanium body of the tiger to resist the puny dogs biting psi? They wouldnt have, have to give the tiger a shot if the teeth didnt penatrate the skin now would they?

The screaming of the wild dogs last breath would only re-double their furry and prowess and probably attract more dhole in the area who are now full of vigor, have a full gaged of vitality while the tiger already is now winded from killing one or two. Its not a kamikaze when the dog is actually showing skill of maunverability like the one did againt the two hyena video. Unsupported? You mean you are too afraid to ask them for what....you...want...(since I dont have to email them, I believe them as is) the only thing I have gotten straight about you is, no matter how many litterature of eyewitness accounts is brought in, you will deny it, you are one of the, need to see video deniers out there...nothing to do with truth or false, you just want things your way, and you do everything you can to uphold this pesudo refuting.

Which your pseudo-refuting can actually be null'd just the same, show me a video of a tiger going up against a large pack of wild dogs, and not being injured. Bet you cant. (wink) Hence your poor, contradicting opinions, are unsupported and have zero validations to your claims. Wow, now that was easy (laugh).


Edited by Prime - 16-Jun-2015 at 20:52
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 21:23
Ah, no P, scientific evidence-based research does not work like that..

I suggest you look up the hierarchy of research validity.( & that of 'sources' - in literature review, such as primary, or lesser)..

No need to descend to making up even more fanciful stuff such as the kids do on Carnivora ( & funnily enough, I today 'earned' a ban in perpetuity - from there, for mentioning their stupidities - here!), like Ti framed tigers..

As I noted earlier, I do not doubt that dogs would/do employ harassment -'dogging' tactics against a rival predator, but I do contend that it would be,( & is, as actually shown by the video evidence), done fairly circumspectly with that big cat,& keeping out of tiger striking/grasping range - for sure - if they valued their lives..

Like-wise as D. Attenborough commented, if the tiger does grab a d'hole, it will destroy it on principle, but it would not - usually - bother to waste much of its energy to gain such a small morsel, ( unless sorely aggrieved), accordingly..


& have another look at the instances of 'game' trained fighting dogs being set on fierce lions, for sport, where they soon lost their ardour for the fight in panic, when they saw their fellows smashed so devastatingly..

Why do you imagine small wild dogs - who have to forage for a living,
would be any less fearful.. than trained, big bred 'game' dogs..

It does not compute..



Edited by J.A.W. - 16-Jun-2015 at 21:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 21:30

Okay.

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