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Topic ClosedWild Dog vs Bengal tiger

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Wild Dog vs Bengal tiger
    Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 06:07
Email them and post the scan....(chuckle...hooo giggle). wink
 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 06:21
Originally posted by Prime

Email them and post the scan....(chuckle...hooo giggle). wink
 

You on the bhang P?

Its your idea, you email them, get the vet's report.. post it..
 & I 'll check the bona fides.. just to make sure its not more BS.. eh, P..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 06:30

Nah, you email them....c'mon ^_^

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 22:42
Right.. as if..

This link to a dog site: http://www.retrieverman.net/2010/08/17/the-wolfs-only-major-natural-predator/

Shows that the largest wild dog,  the Eurasian wolf - is preyed upon by tigers..
It also notes that big cats seem to have a preference for the taste of dog flesh, though I don't
know if this only applies to Asian big cats..

Now, given that the d'hole is a much smaller/less capable  killer than the wolf..
( zero history of d'hole attacks on people vs wolf attacks being notorious).

It stands to reason that - the d'hole preys on tigers myth - is quite fallacious..
& is  "unlikely" at best, esp' given the towering lack of reputable evidence..




Edited by J.A.W. - 08-Jun-2015 at 22:44
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 23:00

Not all that interested, I was headin back to the L vs T thread, just left some crumbs for anyone who wants to seek historic data, on a side not, that doesnt prove anything still, tigers are loners and yet they have more attacks on man than lions, thats because one doesnt lode humans and tigers do, either because humans are a easier meal for a lesser survivalist, or tigers just hate humans/everything they pass, and are reputable as blood thirsty...

2nd, I havent seen any info of eurasian wolves packs as large as dholes, so a small pair stands no chance compare to a super pack, (and lol a artifact only? I thought you needed photos and videos) an there are tons of books on google books as well of siberian tigers control wolf poluations, yet not a single photo of a tiger and wolf in the same shot in all of siberia or muncharia via google images, not just of this era, but any era...c'mon, i can find atleast both dhole and tiger in the same shot, show me a shot of a big bad wolf with a tiger...just 1.
 
Any ways I dont really care for eithers verdict, just left bread crumbs for some one out there who would.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 23:05
Well P, you could check out that recent ( & documented, inc pix) cougar kill of a large wolf story..
If a pseudo-big cat can kill a wolf, then the biggest big cat - surely can.. let alone a d'hole..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 23:16
Did the puma fight 20 wolves? Because thats how dhole roll with.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 23:36
20 huh? How'd you figure on that?
So you imagine that d'holes count out & pick a 1st XX combat team - to go on anti-tiger kamikaze sorties then eh, P?

Yeah right.. too funny..

& if they really are like a doggy version of the piranha feeding frenzy.. or army ants..
or whatever fanciful analogue that boosts their mythical status.. as fearless tiger killers..
..then why don't they predate/attack humans, as leopards & tigers do?

Sorry, P - but the jolly old Raj jungle fables - simply don't add up..
..when exposed to the hard, cold, light of forensic scientific scrutiny..



Edited by J.A.W. - 08-Jun-2015 at 23:43
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jun-2015 at 23:53

Did that puma fight 20 wolves simultaneously?

I am not a dhole expert nor care of their statistics, I merely posted stuff from...credible people, of what they have to say, if it bothers you so much, take it up with them.


Edited by Prime - 08-Jun-2015 at 23:56
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2015 at 00:08
Originally posted by Prime

Did that puma fight 20 wolves simultaneously?

I am not a dhole expert nor care of their statistics, I merely posted stuff from...credible people, of what they have to say, if it bothers you so much, take it up with them.

Yeah P, its likely that 'Merican pseudo-big cat would've swatted them 20 pesky d'holes down like flies..

( check the youtube vid of the cougar swatting the baying hound dogs getting in its face, one-after-another)

& so - since when-  was some illerate old dhobi-wallah considered "credible" as a wildlife naturalist?
..though - to be fair, such a person would still be more "credible" - than an Indian 'news' report..

The only 1/2 way "credible" naturalist - 'K' - reckons.. "unlikely"..  & so there it is..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jun-2015 at 03:25
(2000)
 
encounters with dangerous game, such as boars and tigers. There are many
instances on record of wild dogs having tree'd both tigers and panthers, and one,
of their having killed and partly eaten a tiger at Bandipore on the Mysore frontier
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jun-2015 at 05:41
Sorry P, that link didn't work - for me..

Was it actually a reliable 1st hand eye-witness account?
Or another dubious hearsay story - that purported to claim it - as fact..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jun-2015 at 06:22
Link works for me.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jun-2015 at 23:24
Well P, it won't for me, it just goes to a list of books..
Can you at least quote the gist of the report?

Since so many so-called 'reports' are either from not directly
witnessed events, unreliable 'witnesses',or - are after-the-event guesses..

D'holes likely would scavenge the carcase of an already dead tiger,
but that is not proof that they had killed it..
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 03:31
It states pretty much what I quoted...I find it interesting a single dog killed a tiger by grabing his throat when he was unaware as posted on the L vs T owned by hydeyoshi...yet 30 wild dogs cant injure and wound a 200-400 lb tiger? Tigresses big ones or sundarban ones range only from the 150-300 lb range, 30 dogs 40 lbs each, would weigh past a 1,000 lbs, much more enough to hold the tiger or tigress in place and well sure to wound him, a person can take a shank or two, but 20+ mini shanks thats repeative for an hour? C'mon, I am not degrading the tigers fighting skills or weapons, but tigers are the least combative of the big cats, the least brave, they hardly would intimidate a large pack of dogs looking smaller than their usual prey of sambar.
 
They are not lions, wild dogs and hyenas understand the lionesses have a safety net, the males, who are also in coalitions, they dont just forget this when one male is on his own, they would still be cautious of his brotherns who might pop out at any minute to aid him, what would wild dogs or wolves be cautious of the tigers back up? He has none. Again, tigers arnt like lions, they dont go trumpeting in wageing war and diving into packs careless of their own health (which would lead to a small injury, which would lead to death), tigers are quite passive espeacially something that shows fight and is able to survive the first instances of his rushes/attacks.
 
Just showing information from what is coming from your average, biologist, naturalist, conservationlist and credible source...its quite telling when alot agree with each other...if it were just one or two reports I would dought it my self, but viewing how sometimes wild dogs of india are able to contend with hyena, (who hyena are by far no push overs in clans)...than I think their cousins the dhole has the right of way to being called indias top predators. Bottom line is, 20-30 is just too much.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 03:40
Nt on topic perse and I'll admit that openly...But I personally have seen yotes, around 10-15 of em, iirc, take down a 800 lb heifer in deep snow, up on the Llano, before I could get there to drive em off her.

Wasn't pretty but that's nature.
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Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 03:46
Yeah, ok P, but those 'stories' are IMO, likely the old hard copy/book equivalent of 'viral' - & when repeated longitudinally over long periods of time by credulous types they take up a 'life' of their own..

Yet crucially nothing in the way of unequivocally substantive evidence seems to exist - to actually corroborate these old tales..

& I thought it was a bear that got a dog latched on to its throat..

Does indeed seem "unlikely" that a dog as small as a d'hole could feasibly tackle a healthy fully-clawed wild tiger like that..

& CV, to be sure, dogs can be bold/destructive in attacking domestic beasts.. can't see 'em making a living out of preying on prime tigers though, that's just a bit too far fetched - by 1/2..


Edited by J.A.W. - 16-Jun-2015 at 03:50
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 05:22
Well I am not here to force you to believe in them, you can believe in anything you want...wheather they are hear say or not, rumors/false and truths are often revealing. When I believe in something I try to stay with the evidence I bring, you are right though, finding a bunch of dogs eating a dead tiger carcass they didnt see the fight of, is not a 100% fact...but the consistancy level is there, and the plausibility is there, it will just take time to find a more credible source or atleast one that offers up tangible evidence to confirm the others...a more scientific one that offers up photos for further disecting it would be better, and of course if it is ever caught on film, well, than I would assume that all the other accounts will then be accountable.
 


Edited by Prime - 16-Jun-2015 at 05:27
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 17:30
Actually P, my standard level of doubt/disbelief is high,
& as to these stories being plausible, well I don't think so..

Where else in the world are wild/feral dogs noted to do this?

Viz: recklessly attack hugely dangerous opponents - at the cost of many deaths/injuries to their own pack, & on a supposedly habitual basis..

Nowhere,I know of..

Unless there is repeatable, reliable/verifiable, scientifically
validated/documented results available - to back these jungle fables( & there just aint, AFAIK) then - sorry, no cigar..

D'holes are kept in zoos. but are they so implacably vicious in captivity?
Not that I've heard..

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2015 at 17:58

Alot of your arguments previously made were counter-productive, pretty much controdictions...what exactly would they have to do to the tiger? Just run around it in cricles until the tiger tires out. As fast as a tiger is, its not easy catching one as they are skillfull in manuvering:

 
20-30 wild dogs would have the tiger a difficult time focusing on one. Your argument of claws and jaws is limited as well, the tiger can attack only one at a time, (which cost energy), ripping, biting and constantly turning when getting bitten as well, (cost energy), these wild dogs will completely surround the tiger in a 360 degree form:
 
Wild dogs even alone will atleast defend theselves, 30 defending themselves would have no trouble wounding a single animal who is not much bigger than their usual prey, who has no intimidating factors, both physically and physicologically, has no protecting factors, poor endurance, ect. No one is saying the tiger wont catch one, or several, no one is saying in every encounter it will be a blood bath with the dogs aggressors 100% of the time, but you suggesting that tigers have infinite amounts of stamina/endurance is illogical. The tiger is not as calm, assertive and pre-game as the lion is, a tiger wont only be weary of a large pack of wild dogs, but he will be in a panic, this sky rockets his respitory and rational thinking, many tigers have been documented being killed by heat stress alone (as shown), being that active all at once couldnt allow the tiger to sustain such a placement unless there was a leverage like the puma video where the puma was up on a tree free from them attacking from the back, the tiger again will be on the ground (as most are too big to climb effectively or there might not be trees for a distance at the time) and surounded completely.
 
In my opinion, the tiger doesnt have a chance against 20+ dogs. Its not that you should lower your standards, you can give it a 10/10 to tigers for all I care, in versa... you should aid the search in your own disbelief...you should in fact contact those people on the 5 wild dogs incident...if you stand corrected, than thats a point to bring up, if you are supplied with tanigble evidence, than it saves the hundreds of more post to come, of living in denial.
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