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The Historical Mary Madgalene

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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The Historical Mary Madgalene
    Posted: 14-Feb-2012 at 02:15
Mary Magdalene was potrayed for centuries by traditional Christianity as a prostitute who repented and became a follower of Jesus; after his death she spend the rest of her life in repentance. Her repentance was the part that drew artists to her, and she was portrayed with gusto by them as a beautiful woman who turned her back on her beauty and the earthly pleasures to seek forgiveness.
Here some of her images as created by different artists in different times:
Caravaggio:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/ed/Mary_magdalene_caravaggio.jpg

Guido Reni
http://www.artsunlight.com/NN/N-R0018/N-R0018-0030-mary-magdalene-in-ecstasy-at-the-foot-of-the-cross.jpg

Jusepe de Ribera
http://www.terminartors.com/files/artworks/5/9/8/59898/Ribera_Jusepe_de-Penitent_Mary_Magdalene.jpg

El Greko
http://judaica-art.com/images/uploads/El%20Greco/St-Mary-Magdalene-border.jpg

Again El Greko
http://www.logoi.com/pastimages/img/mary_magdalene-1.jpg

Gheorghe Tattare
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/26/Gheorghe_Tattarescu_-_Magdalena.jpg/220px-Gheorghe_Tattarescu_-_Magdalena.jpg

Dante Raphael Rosetti
http://api.ning.com/files/FAESbaKrrt7xry4XJzIQ7P6GhWtOFregTAD86iFPQn-sgGbablbgKdBHn1cTSURd1lhccc602QMqliCjjebTQObgzf4NEgXv/MaryMagdalene1877byDanteGabrielRossetti.jpg

She is one of those figures that became so heavily imbued in myth, that for all her popularity as an image we know very little about the real historical person she was. In this thread I would like to keep the religious interpretations of her back, and to talk about what could possibly she had been as a person. So far this is the secular info I scrapped about her:

1. She was born and lived in the small town on Magdala /hence her nick-name, Magdalene/, now Al-Majdal; the both names "Magdala" and "Al-Mjdal" mean "tower", and it's Aramaic name was Migdal Nunnaya or Nunayah, with meaning "Tower of Fish". In ancient times there was flowerimg fishing industry there, as it;s Greek name, "Magdala Taricheae" - Magdala of the Fish Salters - suggests. It is referred to  by it's Aramaic names in the Babylonian and Jerusalem Talmud. It's likely that the name "Magadan" that Matthew 15:39 referrs was a corrupted form of "Magdala":

ΚΑΤΑ ΜΑΤΘΑΙΟΝ 15:39 Greek NT: Tischendorf 8th Ed. with Diacritics
"...καὶ ἀπολύσας τοὺς ὄχλους ἐνέβη εἰς τὸ πλοῖον, καὶ ἦλθεν εἰς τὰ ὅρια Μαγαδάν...."

Which is translated in New International Version (©1984)
"...After Jesus had sent the crowd away, he got into the boat and went to the vicinity of Magadan...."

And in many Bible editions follow the translation of the Cambridge edition on KJB:

King James Bible (Cambridge Ed.)

"...And he sent away the multitude, and took ship, and came into the coasts of Magdala...."

2. She was probably not married, because in that case she would have the name of her husband to bare, not the name of the town she lived in.
Most of what we know of Mary comes from the Synoptic Gospels in the New Testament, according to which she was:
- cleansed by Jesus from 7 demons, which in the line of secularizing I'm attempting here would be probably being cured by a disease of some kind, possibly having 7 symptoms; or cured from 7 diseases, which would seem less plausible, but possible; or being a symbolic imagery for something else.
- was a sister to Martha and Lazarus, the latter being raised form the dead.
- was the first the see the empty tomb on Jesus and the first he appeared to after his resurrection.

She is given more significant role in the Gnostic gospels, according to which:
- she was a apostle, Jesus told her to go and teach together with her brother Philip, but she wasn't suppose to reveal her female character
- she is given her own gospel, in which after the death of Jesus the apostles were all confused and she taught then something that only she knew, because Jesus told this only to her.

The next historical info we have about her is that in 1-2 century AD she was given the title "Apostola Apostolarum" by Hippolitus,  bishop in Rome:
"..."...2 Thimmes writes, "it is significant to note that Hippolytus, bishop of Rome (c. 170-235) [. . .] was the first to grant to Mary Magdalene the title 'Apostola Apostolorum' (apostle to the apostles). In his commentary on Canticle of Canticles he associates her with the bride and with the Bride of Christ, a symbol of the Church" (220-21). According to Lucy Winkett, "The ancient tradition of Mary of Magdala as apostola apostolorum ('apostle of the apostles') is used today by Pope John Paul II" (26. ..."
from "The Pity She is a Whore - The Revision of Mary Magdalene in Contemporary Fiction" by Kevin Brown - I cannot give a link to the article because it's from Questia, I'm subscribed to it but it would be against the rules to post an open link with Questia here.

Later, in 591 Pope Gregory the Great mixed her with the image of repentant prostitute in the NT, and had a homily against her and her sins. In 1969 the Vatican tacitly separated Mary of Magdala from Mary of Bethany /who was the repented prostitute/ via the Roman Missal/.
So now we know that Mary of Magdala wasn't a prostitute. But who was she really?




Edited by Don Quixote - 14-Feb-2012 at 02:23
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2012 at 04:53
She's a fascinating figure, highly mythologised and pilloried as Mary the prostitute, to juxtapose against Mary the virgin. Many modern theorisers now want to make her Mary the lover.

In the gospel of Luke, Chapter 8 verses 1-3, Mary Magdalene was one of the women who supported Jesus and his disciples as they moved around the country. Presumably this was financial help and hospitality, so possibly she had some wealth or her own house to entertain them in.
She was among a group of women who had been cured of evil spirits and diseases. That the demons are specifically mentioned as connected to her, its unlikely she was cleansed of desease, but rather of possession - a form of madness or hysteria. 7 demons could indicate the severity of her illness, or that she was cured on 7 different occasions, and so suffered from a form of recurring mental illness.

In the New Testament she is not categorically identified as Mary the sister of Martha and Lazarus. That Mary was called Mary of Bethany. It is possible though, and was an early identification. If she were Mary of Bethany, then Magdalene can't mean where she came from, so has a different meaning.

She was called the apostle of the apostles because she was the first witness to the risen Christ and the first to spread the word, although the apostles she told were at first skeptical of her report.

Edited by Sidney - 14-Feb-2012 at 04:54
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Feb-2012 at 21:12
Well, in the Mesopotamian medicine every disease was thought of as resulting by the action of some deity or another - and there was a deity for every disease.  http://www.indiana.edu/~ancmed/meso.HTM   . The Hebrews were descendents of Mesopotamians, /as Hebrew as language separated from Akkadian in 4000 BC/, so it seems logical to me that they would carry some Mesopotamian ideas, in the same way they preserved the Noah and the Flood from the "Story of Gilgamesh". So, I see the disease interpretation is a possible one.

Also, there is a possibility that the 7 demons were allegorical. In the "Forbidden Faith - Gnostic Legacy From the Gospels to the Da Vinci Code" by Richard Smoley, /published2006, HarperCollins Publishers/, I found this interpretation:

"...The number 7 is the key here. Ancient cosmology saw the earth as surrounded by the spheres of the 7 planets then known: the moon, Mercury, Venus, the sun, Mars, Jupiter and Saturn. The spiritual forces of there planets were portrayed by ancient esoteric traditions, including Gnosticism, as malign gatekeepers of the heavenly realms who sought to keep man bound to earth. They are in fact the "rulers of the darkness of this world' mentioned in Eph7:12, As we'll see in the next chapter, the liberation of the soul was seen as an ascent through the 7 spheres and an undoing of the bonds of these malign planetary powers. Thus one who is liberated from these powers could be described as having had "seven devils" cast out of her. in it's figurative language, the Gospel could be saying that the "second birth" of the spirit, symbolized by the Resurrection, is attained first and foremost by one who has transcended the influence of the planets, that is, by one out of whom "7 devils" have been cast.

If this is true, it would help explain the extremely high esteem for mary Magdalene in early Christianity of both the orthodox and heterodox strain. In all likelihood, she was neither a rehabilitated whore, nor the "woman with the alabaster jar' who anointed the feet of Christ. But the Gnostic texts may be hitting upon some truth when they imply that she, of all Christ students, best understood the deepest truths he was trying to impart. Perhaps this was why he was able to tell her "Thou art she whose heart is more directed to Kingdom of heaven that any thy brothers..." pgs. 28-29.

And it's possible the story about the demons to have been just a part of the deification of Jesus, a made-up story like others in the gospels, made to present him as a supernatural person. Of course, I'm just playing with possibilities here, it's anyone's guess what really happened.



Edited by Don Quixote - 14-Feb-2012 at 21:47
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Feb-2012 at 13:36
Originally posted by Don Quixote

Well, in the Mesopotamian medicine every disease was thought of as resulting by the action of some deity or another - and there was a deity for every disease.  http://www.indiana.edu/~ancmed/meso.HTM   . The Hebrews were descendents of Mesopotamians, /as Hebrew as language separated from Akkadian in 4000 BC/, so it seems logical to me that they would carry some Mesopotamian ideas, in the same way they preserved the Noah and the Flood from the "Story of Gilgamesh". So, I see the disease interpretation is a possible one.


Good point. From the gospels I'm confused over what was classed as demon or classed as disease. Jesus isn't reported as casting out demons in every case of his healing, even though the individual is healed, and the Gospel of Mark, book 1 verses 32-34 says of Jesus that "they brought to him all who were sick or possessed with demons" and "he healed many who were sick with various diseases, and cast out many demons" which implies some distinction was being made. A great deal of overlap might have existed in contemporary minds, and we can't really know what they believed Mary was cured of.


Originally posted by Don Quixote

...in it's figurative language, the Gospel could be saying that the "second birth" of the spirit, symbolized by the Resurrection, is attained first and foremost by one who has transcended the influence of the planets, that is, by one out of whom "7 devils" have been cast.


I've not read the quoted book, nor heard this theory applied to Mary before. I wonder if it is suggesting that Mary Magdalene had somehow attained the Resurrection before Jesus had been crucified? And how would it relate to the man in the Gospel of Luke book 8 verses 26-33 who had a 'legion' of demons cast out of him? Curious.

Edited by Sidney - 15-Feb-2012 at 13:41
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 02:49
My impression is that it implies that Mary Magdalene attained higher knowledge, by getting rid of the obstacles that the 7 planets put in front of  humanity and hence create problems this knowledge to be attained. Hence, those planets and their bad influence was the demons. It's kinda "occult" interpretation, which I suppose can be applied by someone who was acquianted with certain Gnostic and Kabalistic ideas - the number 7 was very important there, and layers of symbolism applied to it. I'll try to find more on that; but in general I think that the interpretation of the 7 demons as physical sufferings are more realistic.
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 06:25
The gnostic Gospels of Mary, of Philip and of Thomas are all meant to concern Mary Magdalene. I need to go away and read them. These gnostic works were often once viewed as just as inspired and equal to the present canonical New Testament. Early Christian churches chose themselves which books to read, or were limited by what was available. (The New Testament canon wasn't settled until the 4th century, and even then people still used their old favourites).

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  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 11:21
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 12:53
Originally posted by Sidney

The gnostic Gospels of Mary, of Philip and of Thomas are all meant to concern Mary Magdalene. I need to go away and read them. These gnostic works were often once viewed as just as inspired and equal to the present canonical New Testament. Early Christian churches chose themselves which books to read, or were limited by what was available. (The New Testament canon wasn't settled until the 4th century, and even then people still used their old favourites).

Your words are music to my ears - I'm taking so much heat on another forum for drawing  Gnostic Writings into discussions, /with reasoning similar to yours/ that I just revel in someone having interest in themSmile. I use the a Gnostic archives cite, it has all possible Gnostic/gnostic-connected writings, from the Hermetic Corpus, 2nd century BC  to medieval alchemical writings - but right now I cannot link it, because I'm not on my laptop and this one is not listening to me - here it's its name - www.gnosis.org//library. I'll give you a live link first thing I get home. I'm very fond of reading them, and in particularly like the Gospel of Philip.
Here is the live link: http://www.gnosis.org/library.html
All the Early Christian Gnostic gospels are on the Nag Hammadi place in the index. I'm currently trying to make progress with the Hermetic Corpus - it's a long term projectSmile.


Edited by Don Quixote - 17-Feb-2012 at 22:38
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 12:54
Originally posted by Centrix Vigilis

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history-archaeology/magdalene.html

That's a good link, CV, thanksSmile
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  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 20:10
What happened to her after Jesus ascended into heaven? Did she play a role in the formation of the early church?
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-Feb-2012 at 22:21
Not much is known. I dug out some info by the so-called Blessed James of Voragine, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacobus_de_Voragine  , but the story he gives is like a medieval romance - Mary was rich,  was of royal blood, the daughter of Syrus /Syrian/ and Eucharia /meaning "gracious" a term applied to Aphrodite/; her family owned 7 castles, the village of Bethany and much of Jerusalem; but she preferred to live in Magdala, which supposedly meant "tower".

Here is what I found from him as primary source:
Internet History Sourcebooks
"...And this is she, that same Mary Magdalene to whom our Lord gave so many great gifts. And showed so great signs of love, that he took from her seven devils. He embraced her all in his love, and made her right familiar with him. He would that she should be his hostess, and his procuress on his journey, and he ofttimes excused her sweetly; for he excused her against the Pharisee which said that she was not clean, and unto her sister that said she was idle, unto Judas, who said that she was a wastresse of goods...."

After the resurrection she went to preach in Marseilles:
"...But by the purveyance of Almighty God they came all to Marseilles, where, as none would receive them to be lodged, they dwelled and abode under a porch tofore a temple of the people of that country. And when the blessed Mary Magdalene saw the people assembled at this temple for to do sacrifice to the idols, she arose up peaceably with a glad visage, a discreet tongue and well speaking, and began to preach the faith and law of Jesu Christ, and withdrew from the worshipping of the idols. Then were they amarvelled of the beauty, of the reason, and of the fair speaking of her...And after that, it happened that the prince of the province and his wife made sacrifice to the idols for to have a child. And Mary Magdalene preached to them Jesu Christ and forbade them those sacrifices..."

"...Hegesippus, with other books of Josephus accord enough with the said story, and Josephus saith in his treatise that the blessed Mary Magdalene, after the ascension of our Lord, for the burning love that she had to Jesu Christ and for the grief and discomfort that she had for the absence of her master our Lord, she would never see man. But after when she came into the country of Aix, she went into desert, and dwelt there thirty years without knowing of any man or woman. And he saith that, every day at the seven hours canonical she was lifted in the air of the angels. But he saith that, when the priest came to her, he found her enclosed in her cell; and she required of him a vestment, and he delivered to her one, which she clothed and covered her with. And she went with him to the church and received the communion, and then made her prayers with joined hands, and rested in peace. ..."Ibid.

The whole hagiography is on the link, but the mythologizing of Mary's life is so heavy in it that I don't know if it could be used at all. The whole story about her royal blood and the eponims of Syria and Aphrodite's epithet given as her parents is a direct result of her deifying in the lines of the female goddesses/aspects of the Mother-Goddess, like Aphrodite was. Later when Jesus's mother was proclaimed a virgin /splitting the holistic image of teh Great Mother into positive and negative, which is a typical way of creating mythology/ someone had to take the "bad" side, and Mary of Magdala became exactly that - the repentant sinner, the complete opposite of the Virgin Mary - even the names are the same. This  process of mythologizing was explained by Joseph Campbell in his "Creative Mythology - The Masks of God".

But all this is no good when one tries to uncover some real biographical infoCry...



Edited by Don Quixote - 17-Feb-2012 at 22:31
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Feb-2012 at 11:05
Originally posted by Nick1986

What happened to her after Jesus ascended into heaven? Did she play a role in the formation of the early church?


In the gnostic Gospel of Mary, after the ascension, the apostles were afraid to preach Jesus' words, so "Mary stood up, greeted them all, and said to her brethren, Do not weep and do not grieve nor be irresolute, for his grace will be entirely with you and will protect you" and "she turned their hearts to the Good." Later, she tells the disciples of a vision she had of Jesus and the words he spoke to her. But Peter and Andrew both dismiss her story as unbelievable, although Levi tells them not to doubt her; "If the Saviour made her worthy, who are you indeed to reject her?"

Mary Magdalene is likely included in the Acts of the Apostles, chapter 1 verse 14; [in the upper room in Jerusalem]"All these [the eleven remaining apostles] with one accord devoted themselves to prayer, together with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and with his brothers." This was the day after Jesus Christ is recorded as ascending to Heaven. The next verse states that the brethren numbered about one hundred and twenty.
Chapter 2 verses 1-5 says that "they were all together in one place" on the day of Pentecost when the Holy Spirit descended upon them and they spoke in tongues. Mary Magdalene may have been there, but "they" may only refer to the apostles, as opposed to the whole one hundred and twenty brethren.
Speculation could include her along with the persecuted church in Jerusalem in chapter 8, verse 3; "Saul was ravaging the church, and entering house after house, he dragged off men and women and committed them to prison."

The only other Biblical reference, although tenuous and not one I've come across, is I Corinthians, chapter 9 verse 5; "Do we [Paul and Barnabas] not have the right to be accompanied by a wife, as the other apostles and the brothers of the Lord and Cephas?"
According to the 13th century James of Voragine; "Some say that Saint Mary Magdalene was wedded to Saint John the Evangelist when Christ called him from the wedding, and when he was called from her, she had thereof indignation that her husband was taken from her, and went and gave herself to all delight, but because it was not convenable that the calling of Saint John should be occasion of her damnation, therefore our Lord converted her mercifully to penance, and because he had taken from her sovereign delight of the flesh, he replenished her with sovereign delight spiritual tofore all other, that is the love of God. And it is said that he ennobled Saint John tofore all other with the sweetness of his familiarity, because he had taken him from the delight aforesaid."
So perhaps Mary Magdalene, and some of the other Galilean women who supported Jesus and the apostles, were following their husbands?

Her ministry in the church does not seem to be recorded in any early sources. In contrast to later traditions, Gregory of Tours, the 6th century Frankish historian, apparently says (I've not read the original) that Mary Magdalene accompanied John the Evangelist, with Mary the mother of Jesus, to Ephesus where she died. This may or may not relate to the story of her being John's betrothed/wife. If she were his wife, she would have shared his travels as told of him in the Acts of the Apostles.


Edited by Sidney - 24-Feb-2012 at 11:26
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  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Feb-2012 at 19:40
Mary must have had a larger role than the Gospel writers claim if the resurrected Christ appeared first to her rather than St Peter. She may well have been one of the apostles until Christian censors popularised the superstition 13 was an unlucky number
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Feb-2012 at 21:19
The Christian Gnostic gospels say that she was an apostle - the Acts of Philip says that Jesus told her to go with Philip but not as a woman:
"...94 It came to pass when the Saviour divided the apostles and each went forth according to his lot, that it fell to Philip to go to the country of the Greeks: and he thought it hard, and wept. And Mariamne his sister (it was she that made ready the bread and salt at the breaking of bread, but Martha was she that ministered to the multitudes and laboured much) seeing it, went to Jesus and said: Lord, seest thou not how my brother is vexed 95 And he said: I know, thou chosen among women; but go with him and encourage him, for I know that he is a wrathful and rash man, and if we let him go alone he will bring many retributions on men. But lo, I will send Bartholomew and John to suffer hardships in the same city, because of the much wickedness of them that dwell there; for they worship the viper, the mother of snakes. And do thou change thy woman's aspect and go with Philip. And to Philip he said: Why art thou fearful for I am always with thee...."
http://wesley.nnu.edu/sermons-essays-books/noncanonical-literature/noncanonical-literature-nt-acts/acts-of-philip/

So Mary was baptizing women, and Philip was baptizing men, as they went together; the gospel is full with fantastic stories like praying for am leopard and as a result the leopard speaking and becoming converted, then a dragon attacking them and in answer of their  prayer light coming and blinding the dragon - the usual deifying and miracle stories, full with symbolism. But, as in most fantastic stories, there are parts of that writing that deserve attention - like the fact that the Christian Gnostics considered Mary of Magdala as one of the apostles.





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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Feb-2012 at 21:27
There is something behind why Jesus in the "Acts of Philip" said that Mary is not supposed to reveal her feminine aspect - since women weren't seen with any spiritual value at the time, a woman had to be a "man" in a spiritual sense in order to be seen as an apostle.
From the "Gospel of Thomas":
"...22. Jesus saw some babies nursing. He said to his disciples, "These nursing babies are like those who enter the (Father's) kingdom."
They said to him, "Then shall we enter the (Father's) kingdom as babies?"
Jesus said to them, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner, and the upper like the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, when you make eyes in place of an eye, a hand in place of a hand, a foot in place of a foot, an image in place of an image, then you will enter [the kingdom]."..."
The Gospel of Thomas Collection -- Translations and Resources

"...114. Simon Peter said to them, "Make Mary leave us, for females don't deserve life."
Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit resembling you males. For every female who makes herself male will enter the kingdom of Heaven."..."

The both quotes talk about the necessity of becoming one full person to enter the kingdom of heaven. According to Grace M. Jantzen in her "Power, Gender and Christian Mysticism' early Christianity woman who achieved spiritual growth was considered "a honorable man", because spirituality came to be considered a male characteristic. She gave examples of such women
Power, gender, and Christian mysticism - Grace Jantzen - Google Books

In this context we can understand why Jesus said that he will make Mary "a man" - he said that he will make her spiritual, will make he a disciple, and apostle, like his other apostles. So I suppose that this is how she was seen by the Christian Gnostics - as equal to the other apostles. In the "Acts of Philip" she was worshipped together with Philip and Bartholomew, as equal to them:
"...And they fell and worshipped Philip and Bartholomew and Mariamne; and all set out together praising God...."http://www.gnosis.org/library/actphil.htm





Edited by Don Quixote - 29-Feb-2012 at 21:30
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Mar-2012 at 17:17
Found this essay. Thought it interesting, and it pulls together references from the New Testament, Gnostic literature and the Talmud regarding Mary Magdalene and her importance to the Gnostic traditions, the references to becoming a man, and the later traditions of her being a prostitute and going to Marseilles.
http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/art_mary_magdalene.htm

Edited by Sidney - 01-Mar-2012 at 17:20
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  Quote Nick1986 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Mar-2012 at 19:28
Looking back, it's strange to think Mary was changed into a man. It sounds like Jesus was a proto-feminist willing to give believers equal treatment if they proved themselves
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Mar-2012 at 23:23
It's more like since women were seen only in there traditional role of mothers-wives, they were refused by the society the ability to have spiritual life; having the last was male characteristic, so a woman who dares to be more that what her biology implies was considered an "honorary man". I see the expression "change your woman aspect" like allowing her to behave like a man - have a spiritual life and teach and baptise - /something what only men were allowed to do in the Jewish tradition, women couldn't become rabbis/.

I think Jesus was a feminist of sorts, even in his NT gospels - he doesn't make sexist distinctions, and teaches women as well as men, in fact this is why Christianity became so popular amongst women., Roman women in particular, which is well documented.
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Mar-2012 at 23:25
Originally posted by Sidney

Found this essay. Thought it interesting, and it pulls together references from the New Testament, Gnostic literature and the Talmud regarding Mary Magdalene and her importance to the Gnostic traditions, the references to becoming a man, and the later traditions of her being a prostitute and going to Marseilles.
http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/art_mary_magdalene.htm

For some reason the link gives me that the page cannot be foundConfused
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  Quote Sidney Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Mar-2012 at 17:18
Originally posted by Don Quixote


Originally posted by Sidney

Found this essay. Thought it interesting, and it pulls together references from the New Testament, Gnostic literature and the Talmud regarding Mary Magdalene and her importance to the Gnostic traditions, the references to becoming a man, and the later traditions of her being a prostitute and going to Marseilles.
http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/art_mary_magdalene.htm
For some reason the link gives me that the page cannot be foundConfused



Sorry Don Quixote. Can't seem to attached link.
http://www.robertmprice.mindvendor.com/art_mary_magdalene.htm

Edited by Sidney - 04-Mar-2012 at 17:19
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