Origins of language!

Yes, I heard Bulgarian folk tales about that - the Bulgarian words is "svraka". There are some Bulgarian sayings, like "He steals as a svraka" and 'The cunning svraka will be caught with his both legs" that feature the thieving nature of the bird.

There is a story for kids about jackdaw nest full with glittering objects:Jewelery of all kinds!Chavka is thief that likes "Flame-able obedience" and features itself with it at home!Languages as we know today were
changed not so far from today:middle ages or in 16-17 century.Books&Newspapers made the rest.

Originally posted by medenaywe I found some "zd" though in Czech: br-zda - brake=Order-like sprout tongues agreement! This sounds strange that a verb that means destruction with have the word "agreement" in it. The word "order-like" - can you give it to me in some Slavic language? I have to think about that. ode-zd - departur=Nestable Deity tongues gift! To depart from somewhere can be seen as a "gift"; Hermes was the Greek god who watched over people who travel - hence, "deity"; tongues=announces. So, may the "deity" protect you /nesting/ I "announce" your this "gift" to you" - to travel was a very dangerous affair in ancient times, they needed lots of gifts from the divinities so they make it alive. pra-zd-ni - empty; in Bulgarian the same word became "pra-zen" - the "zd" going into "z" with one lenition=Liquid arm prays mother's!(prazen). When one has nothing /is empty' one pray a lot to all kinds of mother-goddess /since mother-goddess gives fruition/ to give him/her something to fill the emptiness with - whether one talks about material wealth, or children. In Bulgaria "prazna jena" /empty woman/ used to mean woman that have no children - archaic use - her womb is empty. ji-zd-ne - fare=(Dji=ji?) I suppose it can be seen like that "dji" is on one fortition step from "ji"; one step change is very easy to make in one language, let alone when passing from one language to another. Now "prazen chovek" means a person with no real ideas and aims in life, one who roams around like "ant without head" and has no value. zde - here=Tongue-like Deity I found this is Roma language: bu-tji- possession - "tj" is a one lenition step from "dz"=Lovely dream pluralizes! Very fitting - people have lovely dreams about wealth, and plural stands for "more, much" wealth. dzo-lana and djo-lano, - both in use for "mule"; in this word can be see how easy is for "dz" to pass into "dj". Maybe you can use "dj" words for "dz"? mi-dj-lo-li- erection=Peaceful animal draws light! I like the "draws light" phrase - it goes well with "between two people there is only light"; animal - OK, sex is animalistic, it's supposed to be like that; peace is one that creates, war only destroys; hence a creative organ has to be "peaceful". min-dj - female genitals=Peaceful mother's animal! If genitals are seen as "peaceful animal" then the female one would be "peaceful mother's animal" - since the mothers have in. I had used some animals as metaphors for sexually important bodily parts in poems. su-man-dji - family heirloom=Hungry support mother's beasts!(beast verb?) Verb for beast - "beasting; beasting out" /but this one is my poetic creation, I don't know how gramatically correct it is. In many African cultures women had been bought with cows; "beast" was used for domesticated animals in up to 20 century English. One was hungry in ancient times if one doesn't have any family heirlooms. thrushal o-dji - hungry soul=Dreaming arrow hands joking spark and nestable beast! In Bulgaria they say "Hungry hen dreams about wheat" - we dream about what we don't have /Jung actually considered the dreams being a compensatory mechanism, that restore our psychological balance - like all my dreams happen in Bulgaria/; so what one needs and don't have, and is hungry for, oen dreams about, and has the feeling of spark/energy, and feels contented/"nested". Te shordjol muri godji sar shordjol kadi bera - May my brains flow out the way this beer flows out if Te shordjol muro rat - May my blood spill=Predictive riddle sprouts (animal nest word?!?)sparkand vaginal root dreams! Animal nest=lair. This is some kind of swearing, /like - may by blood spill if I lie/; so the result of the lying would be "predictable"one would spill his/her blood; the vaginal root thing may refer to the female monthly, which is a good reference to blood-spilling; in ancient societies women were considered polluted when in it and were isolated in a special hut - so I suppose this would be a threat any men would be terrified of. djezbe - little conical coffee pot with long handle, the same word is used in Bulgarian=Defensive tongue promises! The long handle of the pot look juts like a tongue, it's defensive because it stays cool while the coffee is brewing and one can hold it without burning one's hand; the promis eis on delicious fresh coffee. My favorite grandma in Shumen used to make what she called "Turksih coffee" - the freshly ground coffee is mixed with teh same amount of baked and ground garbanzo bean, then it's heated slowly until think foam forms on the top and starts growing up - when the foam reaches the rim of the "djezbe" one removes the pot from the fire, places some foam in the coffee cups, then pours the coffee on - it was so delicious, and aromatic! then one drinks it with a glass of cold water. I miss that coffee so much.

Good fitting images, Master of Meaning.
Picture of "djezbe" with it's hadle-tongue

Here several Hungarian words with the interesting syllable "dsz" - I think this is "dz" with a half lenition to it, not even a full linguistic step of change; it is supposed to be pronounced "dz", because the week "s" melts with the stronger sound of "z"; so it's "dz" IMHO for all practical purposes:
ren-dsz-eresen - regularly
ren-dsze-rind - as a rule
ren-dsz-mtabla - number plate
ren-dsze-r - system

With "ch" /written cs/
csu-klami - hiccups\csi-po - hip
cse-cse-mo - infant
csa-rda - inn
tolma-cs - interpreter
pa-csi-rta - lark
ki-csi - little
ala-cso-ni - low
csi-nalni - make

csa-ladi alapota - marital status
csa-lad - family - In Bulgarian 'cheliad' means 'children', dialectic
csa-k - only
csa-ladnev - famili name
csa-lodas - dissapontment
csapat - team
csa-tlakotas - connection
cse-kely - slight
csekk - check

cse-nd - silence
cse-ndes - quiet
cse-ngetni - to ring the bell
cse-pp - drop
cse-relni - to change
cse-resznye - cherry; in Bulgarian - "cheresha"
cse-sze - cup
csi-llag - star
csi-nos - pretty
csi-pke - lace
csi-pos - hot

cso-da - miracle
cso-dalamos - wonderful
cso-dalkozni - to marvel
lat-cs0 - opera glasses
pala-csi-nta - crepe; the same in Bulgarian
cso-mang - parcel
csa-var - screw
csu-szos - slippery


Hungarian is supposed to be a Uralic language, and as such connected with Estonian and Finish, and the little Republic of Mari El in Russia. The Uralic languages are loosely connected to the Indo-European family, and both Urasiatic and Nostratic hypotheses consider Indo-Europeans nd Uralic families to make one larger one Indo-Uralic language family. In any case it's good to have a representative on one more language family here, so far we have Indo-European and Afro-Asiatic /with Ancient Egypt/represented.

I miss the order of answering here!Are those words you talk about?
kara-kon-dzol - I think it's a Turkish word, it means something like a demon
par-dzu-l, which I also heard as "parzul" - means human excrement, and it's likely a Turkish word
It there were some words with dz in Russian and Bulgarian they probably passed into "z" or "dj". How about words with "zd"? From "dz" to "zd" is only one metathesis, and there is a word with "zd" in Bulgarian:
zve-zda - star

In Czech the only "dz" I found is
dze-m - jam

I found some "zd" though in Czech:
br-zda - brake
ode-zd - departur
pra-zd-ni - empty; in Bulgarian the same word became "pra-zen" - the "zd" going into "z" with one lenition
ji-zd-ne - fare
zde - here

I found this is Roma language:
bu-tji- possession - "tj" is a one lenition step from "dz"
dzo-lana and djo-lano, - both in use for "mule"; in this word can be see how easy is for "dz" to pass into "dj". Maybe you can use "dj" words for "dz"?
mi-dj-lo-li- erection
min-dj - female genitals
su-man-dji - family heirloom
thrushal o-dji - hungry soul
Te shordjol muri godji sar shordjol kadi bera - May my brains flow out the way this beer flows out if
Te shordjol muro rat - May my blood spill
djezbe - little conical coffee pot with long handle, the same word is used in Bulgarian
  Will fix it tomorrow.I am tired now!Bye!

I am so sorry i am right Don!I need longer sentences for structure analysis here,they will come directly from my virtual stone maybe!We have a lot of job to do here.I am hungry for words.Big mouth starves big mouth needs food!(Strumpf's character replica!)
 

Chaharshanbe Suri=Flame-able destination sprouts comical mother's promise and hungry resurrection!  

Originally posted by medenaywe zd-rave  - health=Tongue-like gift delivered!(rave=To It Hand make=shaking usual regard between 2 pople). Being healthy is really a gift, and a "gift" being "delivered", even though I don't know what a tongue has to do with it. zd-ravei - hello /literally "be heatly"/=Answer to(Tongue-like gift delivered),help me here Don,IF someone salutes you,you will re-salute?Word is needed here! Yes, you say "zdravey" the other person say "zdravei" or "zdrasti" which is the same - "be healthy". zd-rav - healthy for a person; sturdy, hard, durable for a thing=Tongue-like gift arms obedience! To be healthy means to have your body obeying to your mind - "obedience of arms".

I think it connects well

I just got a bunch of dicts from the library - Hebrew, Tajik Turkish, Hungarian, Kurdish, Urdu, Amharic, Pashto, Slovak, Bosnian, Serbo-Croatian, and a separate small Serbian one, so before going to "nj" I'm gonna give one more shot for "dz", "choi and "chui".

Edited by Don Quixote - 08-Mar-2012 at 18:04

Originally posted by medenaywe Latin words you have?Post them!

Latin words with what? There isn't "dz", "zd", "choi" and "cui" in Latin; I can get you only "ci" and "co", pronounced like si and co ot ki and ko. I have to run, I'll comment on your work later. Tell me what syllables you need from Latin and Italian, I hope to get more dict today form the other library.


Edited by Don Quixote - 08-Mar-2012 at 12:58