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Where is God?

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Athena View Drop Down
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  Quote Athena Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Where is God?
    Posted: 01-Dec-2010 at 11:53
Originally posted by dattaswami

Originally posted by balochii

ont hindus beleive in like 300 gods?? instead of one?
 

Why did God express Himself in different forms in a single Hindu religion in India? In the universe, God expressed Himself in a single form in every religion. In Christianity, there is only one expressed form i.e. Jesus. In Islam, there is only one expressed form i.e. Allah or Mohammad. But in Hindu religion, there are different expressed forms of God like Vishnu, Shiva etc.

 
Diversity in the forms of God is only the first point in Hindu religion. The next point is the unity in all these forms that also exists in Hindu religion. People are criticizing the Hindu religion showing only the first point. Why don’t they see the second point? The concept is not complete by the first point. Now, the question comes, “Why should there be diversity at all and make the unnecessary effort to bring the unity? Why Hinduism is not having a single form of God as in Christianity or Islam?” All right [Agreed].

 

Let us assume that there is a single form in Hindu religion and let us assume that Vishnu is that single form. Then, does this solve the problem when you take the entire world? Now, there are three forms of God i.e. Jesus, Allah or Mohammad and Vishnu. Now, if you take the world as your system for studying, is there a single form of God for the entire world?

 
Even if we solve the problem at micro level i.e. Hinduism, but the same problem is appearing at the macro level i.e. the world. The solution at macro level is very important than at the micro level because in India, wars never took place between the followers of Vishnu and the followers of Shiva. But in the world, wars have taken place and are still taking place between the followers of Islam, Christianity, Hinduism etc. The problem at the micro level never disturbed the peace. But, the problem at macro level always disturbed the peace of the world.

 

To use a medicine on human beings at macro level, it is first tested in the laboratory on a micro system like a rabbit. When the medicine is proved in the case of the rabbit, it is administered to all the human beings. Similarly, the concept developed in the unity of various forms of God in Hinduism should be taken totally by all religions in the world. As the medicine cured the disease of the rabbit, it cures the same disease in all the human beings. Similarly, the knowledge of unity of various sub-religions in the Hindu religion should be applied as it is to the case of all the universal religions. This knowledge is the medicine. The fanatic is the disease.

 
This knowledge not only cures various fanatics in the Hindu religion, but also cures the various fanatics of religions in the world. Infact, there is only one God in Hinduism i.e. Lord Datta who appears in various forms like Vishnu, Shiva etc. Actually, God Datta purposely created the diversity in the forms of God in Hinduism to teach the unity in diversity in all the religions in the world. This is just like a mini model prepared to represent the entire world.
 

The same design in the mini model appears as a huge building when constructed. Similarly, the concept in Hinduism is the message for the entire universe. Lord Datta is the teacher for the world. A teacher praises his student in one subject and praises another student in another subject. He will ask them to help each other. Similarly, India should learn the sacrifice from abroad and the rest of the world should learn about unity in diversity from India.

 

One has to take the good aspect from every religion. I do not belong to any religion but belong equally to all the religions. I do not support or condemn any religion blindly. I pick up the pearls from all the oceans. I criticize Hinduism for several points like not doing the sacrifice of money or work for God, caste system etc. As per the point of unity in diversity is concerned, I praise Indians.

 
I criticize the rest of the world. So, irrespective of the name of the religion, one has to pick up the good points from every religion. Are you rejecting the diamond from a foreign country? Diamond is a diamond anywhere in the world. You cannot differentiate an Indian diamond and a foreign diamond. The logic in the unity of Hinduism is based on the same God appearing in various forms and qualities to satisfy the tastes of different people when He comes in human form.

 

 The nature of Vishnu is ‘Sattvam’ i.e. soft nature. So, soft people are attracted to Vishnu. The nature of Shiva is ‘Tamas’ i.e. emotional nature. People of such nature like Shiva. When there is synchrony in nature of the devotee and the human form of God, the attraction and adaptability is more. Then the message of God to that human form reaches the devotee easily. The message is same but the forms of God are different. The same milk is given in different types of cups. Somebody likes a ceramic cup and somebody likes a glass cup.

 
The form of God is as per your liking, but the divine message preached by all forms of God is the same. It is just like the same syllabus present in different language mediums. The unity in diversity in Hinduism is actually practiced by almost all the people. In every house, people celebrate the festival of Vishnu and the festival of Shiva. In every house, the photos of almost all the forms of Hindu God are worshipped in India.
 
I love reading of reality from your point of view.    May everyone note I use the name Athena, and she is one of the several Greek gods.  We have several gods, not because this is the reality of God, but it is the reality of human mind.  We must catagorize things in order to think about them.  Each time the ancients had a new concept, they named a new god and were able to use this new concept in their discussion and thus develop their own knowledge of what is.  It is very unlikely humanity would have advanced if they began with the concept of one God.  Christianity and Isam do not advance humanity, but hold it back.  But you have many gods, and make them interact, you learn so much more.  Please, this is about how our minds work, not about the reality of God.  Thankfully, the catholic church began using the Greek and Roman classics to educate the people.  This lead to the Reinassance of reaon, and got Europe off the deadly path of superstition it was following.  It got us back on the path of science that has been so successful our life expectancy is doubled, and the masses enjoy a standard of living far above the pre WWII stand.   Our blessings came through Greek and Roman classics, not Christianty.
 
Dattaswami, you failed to mention Satan as one of the essential deities for all God of Abraham religions.  These religions do not work without Satan.    India gave us the 0.  At the moment I do not have the words for the importance of the concept of 0, and Dattaswami, I hope you can expound on that.  From one came the many, and before this was 0.   Hum, I need to research one of my math books to be clearer on this thinking.  Let me say here, there must be at least three.  "The meeting of two personalities (God and Satan) is like the contact of two chemical substances; if there is any reaction, both are transformed."  Carl Jung   "The One engenders the Two, the Two engenders the Three and the Thees engenders all things."  Tao Te Ch'ing  "Three is the formula of all creation".  Horore de Balzac 
 
Dattaswami, you are using multi dimensional thinking, and in the west that is domoniated by the religion of the God of Abraham.  these people use daulistic thinking, good or evil, black or white, up or down, one of us or one them., God's chosen people or not.   Can anyone gives us a better understanding of the difference between multi dimensional thinking and dualistic thinking?    I want to add to this that the daulistic thinking is most like to lead men to war.  Whereas multidimensional thinking is more likely to lead them to peace.  Democracy founded on the interaction of many gods, is multidimensional thinking.  Unfortunately, the strongest democracy is also Christian, and this like trying to grow flowers in the refrigerator.  The religion is counterproductive to the potential of democracy.  
 
The God of Abraham is a tribal war god, equal to the patron gods, at this time.  Later, through Persian came Indian concepts of the light and darkness,  the Truth and and the Lie, and the God of Araham evolved from the strongest war God of chosen people, to monotheistic religions that could asorbed people not born into the tribe.  However, the foundation of this momotheism could have been Eygpt, then Sumer, and later reinforced with religion from Persia, which was not so different from Indian concepts.  Unfortunately, the God of Abraham, is a tribal God with chosen people, and is a jealous, revengeful and fearsome war God.   Saying this is a false God, will probably not have a positive effect, but we might have some success at promoting multi dimensional logic.   If we can develop our understanding of how math influenced logical thinking, and why the study of math was considered sacred, we might be liberated from the darkness and entire the light?  
 
Where is God?  We need math to answer this question.  But who is ready to speak this language? 
 
 
 
 
 


Edited by Athena - 01-Dec-2010 at 12:56
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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2010 at 12:58
Originally posted by Athena

Originally posted by BIG D

and ATHENA, how do you know I'm a man???and, racism??the Hutus murdered thousands of Tutsies[?] because of ethnicity....what about the Serbs murdering thousands???...we STILL have racism/genocide/..or the Khmer Rouge murdering thousands??..racism/etc. is acceptable to those who think they are 'right'....and it still exist....

 
You have a big chip on your shoulder, and I hope self awareness makes a difference.
humans sure seem the same--not worse or better---and 2000 years after the supposed coming of jesus, we have the greatest murder/rape/destruction/etc of all....technology changed, but not human nature....god??yes, where is/was he?or jesus, what good did he really do??because we still have murder/rape/robbery/wars/etc. ..do we not???there still is jealousy/greed/anger/racism/etc...no???
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  Quote BIG D Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Dec-2010 at 13:02
Originally posted by Athena

Originally posted by BIG D

there has been really no change in humans[[there is still murder/rape/war/robbery/etc,]] since the beginning...so I don't see what jesus came for, or any of god's/allah's MESSENGERS' PURPOSE...in fact, you had the greatest murder/etc[[per technology] 2000 years after 'jesus came'....
 
How long have been on earth?  Our consciousness has changed a lot!  right now the thing is to talk about those awful Muslims, but not that long ago, Christians were not that evolved either.  Please, man, we are no longer hunting witches and burning them the stake, but now use science to and the study of medicine to explore things like someone's cow die or why people are falling ill.  We are not killing or persecuting someone for understanding God's word differently, although some moderators do tend to have a low tolerance for discussions like this.   
 
The origninal Tarzan movies are shocking, because of their acceptance of killing of animals, and wearing furs is no longer as popular as it once was.  We are much more enviormental aware and going green is a good thing.  The racism of the past is no longer tolerable.  The racist terrorism of the  KKK is not acceptable today.  Nor is persecuting Jews.  Some ignorant people may behave badly, but that is ignorance.   We may always have mentally and emotionally disturb people among us, doing things that are not socially approved of, and I hope we become more rational and humane in managing this reality.   Religion has been a serious draw back in our progress, exspecially regarding our reaction of mentally and emotionally disturbed people, and I hope science will change this. 
 
With computers and the Internet, I expect amazing consciousness tranformation to come.   Anyway to say really there has been is no change, just isn't right. 
science and medicine?a big HAHA<>yes, also used to murder/kill/destroy millions
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  Quote eaglecap Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Mar-2011 at 20:45
Originally posted by dattaswami

Originally posted by balochii

ont hindus beleive in like 300 gods?? instead of one?

 


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman">Why did God express Himself in different forms in a single Hindu religion in <?: prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" /><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>? In the universe, God expressed Himself in a single form in every religion. In Christianity, there is only one expressed form i.e. Jesus. In Islam, there is only one expressed form i.e. Allah or Mohammad. But in Hindu religion, there are different expressed forms of God like Vishnu, Shiva etc.


 

Diversity in the forms of God is only the first point in Hindu religion. The next point is the unity in all these forms that also exists in Hindu religion. People are criticizing the Hindu religion showing only the first point. Why don’t they see the second point? The concept is not complete by the first point. Now, the question comes, “Why should there be diversity at all and make the unnecessary effort to bring the unity? Why Hinduism is not having a single form of God as in Christianity or Islam?” All right [Agreed].

<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><?: prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman"> </o:p>


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman">Let us assume that there is a single form in Hindu religion and let us assume that Vishnu is that single form. Then, does this solve the problem when you take the entire world? Now, there are three forms of God i.e. Jesus, Allah or Mohammad and Vishnu. Now, if you take the world as your system for studying, is there a single form of God for the entire world?


 

Even if we solve the problem at micro level i.e. Hinduism, but the same problem is appearing at the macro level i.e. the world. The solution at macro level is very important than at the micro level because in <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>, wars never took place between the followers of Vishnu and the followers of Shiva. But in the world, wars have taken place and are still taking place between the followers of Islam, Christianity, Hinduism etc. The problem at the micro level never disturbed the peace. But, the problem at macro level always disturbed the peace of the world.

<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><o:p><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman"> </o:p>


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman">To use a medicine on human beings at macro level, it is first tested in the laboratory on a micro system like a rabbit. When the medicine is proved in the case of the rabbit, it is administered to all the human beings. Similarly, the concept developed in the unity of various forms of God in Hinduism should be taken totally by all religions in the world. As the medicine cured the disease of the rabbit, it cures the same disease in all the human beings. Similarly, the knowledge of unity of various sub-religions in the Hindu religion should be applied as it is to the case of all the universal religions. This knowledge is the medicine. The fanatic is the disease.


 

This knowledge not only cures various fanatics in the Hindu religion, but also cures the various fanatics of religions in the world. Infact, there is only one God in Hinduism i.e. Lord Datta who appears in various forms like Vishnu, Shiva etc. Actually, God Datta purposely created the diversity in the forms of God in Hinduism to teach the unity in diversity in all the religions in the world. This is just like a mini model prepared to represent the entire world.

 

<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman">The same design in the mini model appears as a huge building when constructed. Similarly, the concept in Hinduism is the message for the entire universe. Lord Datta is the teacher for the world. A teacher praises his student in one subject and praises another student in another subject. He will ask them to help each other. Similarly, <st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region> should learn the sacrifice from abroad and the rest of the world should learn about unity in diversity from <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>.


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><o:p><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman"> </o:p>


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman">One has to take the good aspect from every religion. I do not belong to any religion but belong equally to all the religions. I do not support or condemn any religion blindly. I pick up the pearls from all the oceans. I criticize Hinduism for several points like not doing the sacrifice of money or work for God, caste system etc. As per the point of unity in diversity is concerned, I praise Indians.


 

I criticize the rest of the world. So, irrespective of the name of the religion, one has to pick up the good points from every religion. Are you rejecting the diamond from a foreign country? Diamond is a diamond anywhere in the world. You cannot differentiate an Indian diamond and a foreign diamond. The logic in the unity of Hinduism is based on the same God appearing in various forms and qualities to satisfy the tastes of different people when He comes in human form.

<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><o:p><FONT size=5 face="Times New Roman"> </o:p>


<P style="MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt" =Text><FONT face="Times New Roman"><SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>The nature of Vishnu is ‘Sattvam’ i.e. soft nature. So, soft people are attracted to Vishnu. The nature of Shiva is ‘Tamas’ i.e. emotional nature. People of such nature like Shiva. When there is synchrony in nature of the devotee and the human form of God, the attraction and adaptability is more. Then the message of God to that human form reaches the devotee easily. The message is same but the forms of God are different. The same milk is given in different types of cups. Somebody likes a ceramic cup and somebody likes a glass cup.


 

The form of God is as per your liking, but the divine message preached by all forms of God is the same. It is just like the same syllabus present in different language mediums. The unity in diversity in Hinduism is actually practiced by almost all the people. In every house, people celebrate the festival of Vishnu and the festival of Shiva. In every house, the photos of almost all the forms of Hindu God are worshipped in <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:country-region w:st="on">India</st1:country-region></st1:place>.


Interesting thesis but to Islam and Christianity (Jews also) Hinduism is made up of many false gods. what 300,000?
To most Christians Jesus was God manifested in the flesh who came to fulfill the Mosaic Law and die for man's sin but I am sure that varies from church to church. I believe in one God but who has time for organized religion! One man's way to Heaven is another man's way to Hell. I heard a U.S. Congressman say this years ago and it stuck in my mind.
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  Quote LeopoldPhilippe Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26-May-2015 at 20:13
God can exist outside of time and space as we know it.       
Many passages of the New Testament affirm the deity of Jesus. He was God who "became flesh and made his dwelling among us." He is the "image of the invisible God."     
Look for the beauty of God in all the marvelous flowers he created.
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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jun-2015 at 22:39
Or find beauty where it exists.. for its own sake..

Ancient myths can be seen - for what they are too..
..the fanciful inventions of men who seek power & control..

God as a supernatural entity - concerned with the minutia of our doings - is at best no more than a story predicated to frighten the gullible child-mind..
..& at worst.. to provide a despicable carte-blanche to despots..
Be Modest In Thyself..
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  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 03:30
Where is GOD?

Same place HE was last time I looked for him.
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 03:44
WOW.. that's really something CV, having such an invisible imaginary friend being - so available to you..

Any time anyone asks me if I 'believe' in a god/s - I find that I have to paraphrase Dr Ray Stantz.. & answer.. "Never met him."
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  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 03:58
Well as I see u present no credentialing in either psychiatry-psychology nor have u interviewed me as to background and cultural traditional religious background...

your assertation that:

''having such an invisible imaginary friend being - so available to you..''..


is not only immaterial. But merely remains the typical answer of those who remain uninformed.
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 04:07
Well.. funny you should mention "credentialing" in "psychiatry" CV..

& since you asked - I have in fact, held such, & practised same for over 30 years..

I would be open to reading more about your specific experiences which
inform your seeming confidence.. that any kind of supernatural deity-type entity..
holds anything more demonstrably substantive to you, than what I have suggested.. in response to your declaration, taken at face-value..
Be Modest In Thyself..
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  Quote Centrix Vigilis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 04:20
Originally posted by J.A.W.

Well.. funny you should mention "credentialing" in "psychiatry" CV..

& since you asked - I have in fact, held such, & practised same for over 30 years..

I would be open to reading more about your specific experiences which
inform your seeming confidence.. that any kind of supernatural deity-type entity..
holds anything more demonstrably substantive to you, than what I have suggested.. in response to your declaration, taken at face-value..


a. you claim...you do not present.

b. therefore any and all experience/s remain personal and to which I have no obligation to provide. And whether they are were taken by you at face value hence... also remains immaterial.

c. So in conclusion; my advice to you, at this point, is to move on. And attempt no effort to bait me or question my faith and it's sincerity. Or question it merely for idle curiosity or an alleged academic interest. To whit leave me with mine..and Ill leave you with yours... or your lack thereof.

Many have tried in this and all have failed.

You will too.

"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence"

S. T. Friedman


Pilger's law: 'If it's been officially denied, then it's probably true'

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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 04:29
"You claim.. you do not present".. a classic 'hoist by your own petard' moment right there, CV..

& unlike any of the god-botherers hereabouts, , I have to "render unto Caesar" for my professional credentials..

The mere fact of your sensitivity at any questioning of the overt absurdity of 'belief/faith' says enough, really.. so nevermind..

To paraphrase Christopher Hitchens..

"What is asserted sans evidence.. may be dismissed accordingly.."
Be Modest In Thyself..
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  Quote J.A.W. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jun-2015 at 05:23
Perhaps a couple of quotes re 'belief' - may be apropos here..

"I choose to believe - what I am programmed to believe!"

&,

"You just have to believe - that the impossible - is merely preposterous."

Both from the splendidly prescient source.. 'Futurama'..
Be Modest In Thyself..
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