Mounted Crossbowmen

I've heard a few references to mount crossbowmen, particularly used by the Poles but I can't seem to find anything more substantial. I have to admit I'm curious to know if they operated as dragoons or did they use tatar style tactics and for how long were they in service etc etc. If anyone can give me a basic overview or link to one I'd appreciate it. 

Originally posted by opuslola Agatharchides, I would think that any "mounted crossbowmen" would be regulated to "One shot and done!" Can you provide us with any method that would allow a mounted knight to re-cock and reload any known cross bow from that era?

Edited by Mosquito - 16-Nov-2010 at 19:01

Thanks mosquito. :) And opuslola, it would depend on the crossbow. Obviously a 500lb draw steel beast takes a winch to cock wouldn't be any good on horseback, but you can make lighter crossbow. A 100lb crossbow is no harder to cock than a 100 pound bow is to fire. And if, as I am understanding it, they stayed still while shooting and then charged themselves, there is nothing particularly impossible about it. 

OK,why don't we, or why don't I make a few suppositions?

First of all, can we assume that the only advantage of the cross-bow over the bow-and-arrow, is its reported ability to penetrate fully armed knights, whereas regular bows could not! So, to penetrate heavy sheet steel armoured knights, it would seem that the bolt of dart of the Cross-bow, whould have to have a "greater" pull, lets say in the range of 120-160 pounds or more, which is considerably more than almost any bowman in the world could pull and shoot accurately! But, a mechanically or leveraged cross-bow with a 150+ pound pull, could possibly shoot a dart/bolt that could seriously harm even the most heavilly armored opponent! And at a considerable distance! It would have more of the force of a bullet in that regard.

Second, one might well consider that these mounted cross-bowmen, were also armored! That is they could readily ride into range and having heighth (being in the saddle) be in position to shoot armoured knights armed mostly with swords, maces, axes and pikes, etc,! Even those on foot!

Riding mostly outside the main melee', they could shoot and run from their other mounted opponents back to their squires, who were in the process of loading another cross-bow! Since it seems obseenly difficult to crank a cross-bow mechanism whilst mounted, or any other method I have yet to see!

They could do so in relays, so part of their group (of what ever size the unit was), would always be getting re-supplied with loaded weapons whilst the rest of them were shooting, and shooting pretty much out of the range of arrows, pikes, etc.

In this manner they might well be a formidable group?

Regards,

What do you all think of this conjecture?

Perhaps some real information can be found here?

http://www.netsword.com/ubb/Forum8/HTML/000234.html

Edited by opuslola - 18-Nov-2010 at 15:02

As did those wild and crazy guys on TV! The "Mythbusters!" Maybe you can see it somewhere?

So, you derided my position in its entirety! With old friends like you who needs enemies?

Perhaps that is why cross-bows were soon replaced with guns?

People of Royalty or Position oft feel the same way, towards those "little people" in the crowd!

Edited by opuslola - 18-Nov-2010 at 16:22

Oh! And just why could one not be able to use the Long Bow from Horse back? Horses are very tall! Bows can be shot holding them in a horizontal manner, etc.!

So, again please show your proofs?

I dare to say that you gave my earlier post more than a passing, before you hit the reply button!

"No soup for you!"

Edited by opuslola - 18-Nov-2010 at 16:36

Thanks my irrating insect friend! I knew you would come thru! Thus the old accounts of armored knights being covered with "darts" and un hurt, might well be true? Notice that the shaft of the arrow broke upon impact, and even if a barbed arrow managed to penetrate the armour, only a part of the shaft might have remained!

But Mosquito, does your archive of great events, show what happens if a "bolt" or "dart" from a cross-bow were to hit the same target from the same distance which in the Video was said to be 20 metres!

You must notice that earlier I had posited the dangerous zone for a plate armored knight to be harmed by a long-bow as being within 50 yards! Perhaps, I was too conservative? NOOO! Not me!

Thanks again Mosquito, and just what do you other experts have to show us?

What about it Red?

Please try some raw steak upon that black eye you must now have!

Edited by opuslola - 18-Nov-2010 at 18:16

First of all, do you or anyone really trust the source(s)? Secondly, there are some historians that question your conclusions, and instead insist that the armored French kinghts were basically caught in a bog of mud, that kept them from advancing, and made them especially "targets of opportunity" for the English!

In other words, they became "sitting or standing ducks!" Overheated inside their thick armor, they lost most of their strength and literally passed out or gave up! This made them easy prey for those with thin knives, or daggers, etc.!, who, while disposing of their cross-bows, began to disassemble those stuck knights in the mud, with daggers and knives!

The same result has a past history, where similar kinghts were easily dispatched, even if they were mounted, when the conditions of the ground made progress impossible as well as taking the opposite course and retreating!

Of course we are oft told that these hard headed knights never even thought of retreat!

Correctly spelled "disassemble!"

Edited by opuslola - 21-Nov-2010 at 06:47

Originally posted by opuslola Oh! And just why could one not be able to use the Long Bow from Horse back? Horses are very tall! Bows can be shot holding them in a horizontal manner, etc.! So, again please show your proofs? I dare to say that you gave my earlier post more than a passing, before you hit the reply button! "No soup for you!"

 

Mounted crossbows have much smaller crossbows, how did you come to the conclusion that they are still equipped with decent crossbows? They need to load the crossbow, the smaller the better, similarly to the carbine cavalries, with down-sized firearms.

About the penetration of the Longbow:

—Hugh Latimer."

Tell me the men in the video was trained from childhood, otherwise, I can't be convince that the penetration of the Longbow was just a myth.