Ghengis Khan

You are distorting my words. I said "Chinese so hated the Mongol rule that they rose up and overthrew the Yuan Dyansty." What do you not understand? Are not Yuans Mongols, and the peasents Chinese? What are trying to disprove? That Yuan was not Mongol and peasents were not Chinese? You should learn to think straight... or read. 

Is French Revolution a "Nationalist War"? I don't think so. Did they believe in World-Wide Brotherhood of Mankind? Yes...

Think about it: did not the Ming pose itself as a Chinese regieme bringing back things Chinese and crushing the barbarians (Mongols) ? Is that not why they shut the doors to the outside world?

Yes ofcourse when a race is under an oppression by another race, especially a minority, the former hates the latter.

1. Catholic Irish hated British

2. French hated Germans.

3. Chinese hated Japanese

4. Natives hated "Palefaces"

Iraqis overthrew Saddam Hussein, does it mean they hate themselves... no. Americans are oppressing Iraqis (or atleast in their opinion)... does that mean they hate Americans, at least in general? yes...

There are instances where a person of race 1 hits another of race 2. Race 1's and race 2's in the area line up behind "their" kind and start bashing eachother. If a race 1 beat up a race 1 would race 1's be all hitting eachother? I don't think so, unless it is gang-wafare.  

Nazi Germans hated the Jews because they were living in "their" land. Does it mean that they hate other Germans for living in their land? I don't think so.

Stop trying to pretend that racial hatreds don't exist and that they have historically been a factor for rebellions, wars and massacres.

It is you who are distorting history - rebellion against Yuan was racially motivated - was there ever a dynasty in China that was so short lived? Why did this dynasty end so quickly when there were just the same amount of famines, floods etc? Racial difference and clash.

Why does Tibet want independence? Race and Culture.

Why does Chechenya want independence? Race and Culture.

Why does Palestine want independence? Race and Culture.

"was there ever a dynasty in China that was so short lived?"

Yes, the Qin and the Sui are even shorter lived, so your wrong as only to be expected from an incompetent amateur like you.

" Why did this dynasty end so quickly when there were just the same amount of famines, floods etc?"

It ended just as fast as any other dynasty that has flood and famine, in fact because the Yuan was able to gain the support of the land owning class it outlasted other dynasties which had famine, so wrong again.

There were famines and floods million times during Tang, Han, Ming and Ching dynasties, so why didn't people rise up and overthrow? Because they were Chinese...  By the way some Mongols wanted to kill off all Chinese and use the land as pasture... Kublai stoped them. So you can basically see how Mongols treated the Chinese - as sword/arrow fodder.

The Germans were able to secure France better because of Vichy collaborators... how does that prove that the majority of French did not have Germans? Hmm... some rich collaborated with Japanese during Sino-japanese War, so it must have been Chinese loved Japanese!

LOL Yuan lasted 1279-1368...  you call that long? Rather pathetic isn't it? What about Ming, Song, Tang, Ching and all that? Were they so blessed that they had no floods and famines... that must be it.

Uneducated Southern "white-trash" country folk of America have the greatest hatred toward Blacks .... is ethnic hatred only confined to those highly-educated? Is not not easier to incite hatred among the ignorant and the stupid?

Note that most of the members of terrorist groups of IRA and UDA in North Ireland come from working-class, ill-educated and squalid neighbourhoods.

Any idiot can hate a Mongol if he is riding around spelendour when common people of his race is starving to death. Unless of course you are full of Maoist propaganda...

I have better books to read then that on China... China isn't the most interesting country anyway.  Long and dull...

You think you can rip politics out of history... oh good there should be no dictators, no democracies, no officers, no commanders, no village chiefs, no decisions, no wars, no events... etc. Good luck in writing politic-free history.

I think you should watch your mouth and stop the "foul ranting"...

Those who use the word bs do it beause they are it...

"some rich collaborated with Japanese during Sino-japanese War, so it must have been Chinese loved Japanese! "

The flaw of your argument is "some" while in the case of Yuan virtually all supported the regime. And for the fourth time, the peasant didn't rebel because Yuan was mongol, they rebeled because they were suffering, its as simple as that, why are you stubbornly resisting depite the fact you have no source to back your rubbish up what soever?

"Any idiot can hate a Mongol if he is riding around spelendour when common people of his race is starving to death. Unless of course you are full of Maoist propaganda... "

He hates him because he is rich and harsh not because he is a mongol.

 "Unless of course you are full of Maoist propaganda... "

Sorry, but the only propagandalist here is you, despite the fact that you have absolutely no bases for your claim while all of mine are based on empirical data, you're just a incompetent historian, stubborn loser, and a time waster.

"I have better books to read then that on China... China isn't the most interesting country anyway.  Long and dull... "

I've already presented my sources, you don't have to read it but the fact remains that you have no sourcfes and all your guess work are nonsense. You've just admitted you've read little on Cnbhina, so why the bloody hell are you still persisting on your clumsy argument?

"You think you can rip politics out of history... oh good there should be no dictators, no democracies, no officers, no commanders, no village chiefs, no decisions, no wars, no events... etc. Good luck in writing politic-free history. "

No, I'm citing historical works by competent historians unlike you, its funny you haven't figured out who really is riping politics out of history in here(in case you're too stupid to know, its you)

"I think you should watch your mouth and stop the "foul ranting"..."

I would watch it when you speak something other than baseless trash. And start reading books, I don't feel like arguing with a moron that don't even know this topic at all tand claim he is right.

"You did not provide sources either... too bad for thou! ""

"I recommend you read Eberhard's history of the Chinese people on the section on Yuan dynasty and see why the rebellion actually started."

Difficult reading?

P

"lus, you just contradicted your own words. Before you said only the rich upper class supported Yuan. Now you say the majority supported Yuan. Are the majority the rich and the upper class?"

No, there is nothing contracting in my statement, The majority I'm reffering to is the majority of the upper class, they makes up 1/10th of the population, but has the power.

"I admit I read little - but what evidence do I have that you know more? "

Easy, I read parts of Yuan Shu and already suggested to you sa source on the origin of the Yuan which you didn't feel like reading, not my problem you're ignorant and lazy at the same time.

"You just accused me of mixing politics with history. Now you accuse me of ripping it out from history. Contradiction again."

Contradiction to what? You have no sources, what I said is fact.

"What makes me believe your sources exist? I could say, I read a book on Yuan by... say Alfred Wheeler (invented name), and I can just invent some examples. Is that not the same for you? Give me a tangeable evidence in form of a website."

" http://rds.yahoo.com/S=2766679/K=a+History+of+china+by+wolfr am+eberhard/v=2/SID=e/TID=H037_119/l=WS1/R=1/H=0/MI=free/IPC =us/SHE=0/*-http://rdre1.yahoo.com/click?u=http://www.gutenb erg.net/etext/11367&y=02F1A2ED37900267&i=482&c=9 310&q=02%5ESSHPM%5BL7~%3FWvlkpmf%3Fpy%3F%7Cwvq~%3F%7Df%3 Fhpsym~r%3Fz%7Dzmw~m%7B6&e=utf-8&r=0&d=wow-en-us &n=E9DK5H4VM53K309N&s=7&t=&m=4147B55B&x= 01304248C43CEDE4"

Happy?

"You said "virtually all" Chines - stop playing around with your words."

No i didn't say "virtually all chinese", i just said "virtually all", and i was refering to the rich, I'm not playing around with words, you just have to learn how to read.

"You make accusations without professional evidence. Bring the professional

evidence for your insults jk.

"

Wrong again, Eberhard is in fact a professional historian, once again you have shown your ignorance and stubborness, what that doesn't surprise me the least bit. 

"I will look into the site when I have time - I have to sleep now 11:48"

Good look at it so you woouldn't be as stupid as you already are. Come back tommorow and I'll crush the rest of your bullsh*t.

"Too bad, you never mentioned the rich in the sentence or in the sentence before neither did you use a pronoun to reference them thus naturally "virtually all" means virtually all Chinese"

No,l since we are talking about the rich, it clearly means the rich, not my problem you don't understand it.

"I said I will read it tomarrow... how is that avoiding? "

You are avoiding the whole topic since I mentioned sui, Qin and jin were all shorter dynasties than Yuan, thus your statement of Yuan been short lived because its mongol is already proven invalid, and you're constantly avoiding it.

"True, the Han, Tang, Song and Ming lasted more than the Yuan, but they never controlled the total area now controlled by the PRC. "

Neither did the Yuan, xing jiang was not part of the Yuan empire.