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Palin doesn't know about Bush Doctrine

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  Quote hugoestr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Palin doesn't know about Bush Doctrine
    Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 15:42
Okay, you Palin/McCain foreign affairs supporters.

We all know how McCain can't tell Sunni from Shia and talks about the border of Iraq with Pakistan.

So McCain is weak/ignorant/senile on foreign affairs.

Here comes PTA mom Palin to the rescue. She is strong in foreign affairs because, the GOP says, she was governor of... Alaska (WTF???)

Well, this interview with her, which was over coached, shows that Palin doesn't know what the Bush doctrine is.

That is right. The major foreign policy of the U.S. for the last 8 years, and she doesn't know what it is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z75QSExE0jU


Let's make a deal. If you are planning to vote Republican, just admit that you are partisan. No biggie here. Being partisan is allowed. Sure, you may want to ask yourself why would you vote dumb and dumber into office, but that is up to you.

But let's give up on discussing about how Palin/McCain are the people for the job.

Obviously senile McCain and airhead Palin are not qualified or fit for the presidency, when doesn't know basic geography and the other one doesn't know the basic foreign policy doctrine that we have.

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 15:43
LOL
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  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 15:50

Unfortunately for us and the rest of the US population these guys will be elected and yet againt we will have another 4 years of stubborness and stupidity making the same mistakes all over again. That is of course if McCain doesn't die first and Msr Palin under orders from God plunges the world into a nuclear holocaust with Russia.

 
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  Quote Byzantine Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 15:55
No matter how one slices it, we must face it, there are a bunch of typical politicians offered up to us this election from both sides.  No one stands out as being better.  Neither party has the priorities of the American people at heart.  There is no third party that can make it.  What do we do then in the opinion of all of you political geniuses?
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:00
she is nuts. seriously out of all the people in the USA you throw up McPain and this muppet?
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:26
Originally posted by Byzantine Emperor

No matter how one slices it, we must face it, there are a bunch of typical politicians offered up to us this election from both sides.  No one stands out as being better.  Neither party has the priorities of the American people at heart.  There is no third party that can make it.  What do we do then in the opinion of all of you political geniuses?
I dont know obama sound like he can think. That interviewer was soft on her and i can understand why they avoid these things.

This twit thinks making Ukraine and Georgia NATO members (a pipe dream but...) and risking war is a sound policy.  Does she read the paper? she also thinks poor liddle Georgia was attacked and that Russia was unprovoked. She knows about russia becuase she can see it from alaska. The whole world is full of friends and terrorist...
.and she complelety squirmed without commiting about Iran and nukes vis a vis Isreal. Serously Iran is going to give nukes to other terrorist!  please she is a muppet

confident talk covers the lack of substance, might work for those that dont understand the any issue beyond cowboy and indians. Fear fear fear.


the whole interview is here.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubsUQKd9c7c&feature=related
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  Quote Byzantine Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:31
Originally posted by Leonidas

Originally posted by Byzantine Emperor

No matter how one slices it, we must face it, there are a bunch of typical politicians offered up to us this election from both sides.  No one stands out as being better.  Neither party has the priorities of the American people at heart.  There is no third party that can make it.  What do we do then in the opinion of all of you political geniuses?
I dont know obama sound like he can think. That interviewer was soft on her and i can understand why they avoid these things.

This twit thinks making Ukraine and Georgia NATO members (a pipe dream but...) and risking war is a sound policy.  Does she read the paper? she also thinks poor liddle Georgia was attacked and that Russia was unprovoked. She knows about russia becuase she can see it from alaska. The whole world is full of friends and terrorist...
.and she complelety squirmed without commiting about Iran and nukes vis a vis Isreal. Serously Iran is going to give nukes to other terrorist!  please she is a muppet

confident talk covers the lack of substance, might work for those that dont understand the any issue beyond cowboy and indians. Fear fear fear.


the whole interview is here.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubsUQKd9c7c&feature=related
 
Again, let me reiterate.  I am not acting as a spokesperson for the McCain/Palin ticket.  There are those who are this type of sycophant on both sides.  What angers me is the hatred for anyone who might have the "conservative" label applied to them regardless of th issues that they stand for.  Would any of you who are ripping the current representation of "conservative" (I do not think the ticket is worthy of being called this at all) be willing to consider someone else with the same label if they had some policies you could agree with?
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:36
Oh well. First I was afraid a McCain ticket would lead to 4 more years of Bush but without the humor. His choice for Palin has made sure that also in a next Republican administration there will be enough to laugh about.
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  Quote SearchAndDestroy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:41
I agree with Leonidas here.
 
When she said she would go to war with Russia if SHE felt it was necessary. That kind of scares me knowing she'd be second incharge and one step away from being number one.
 
She doesn't seem to understand that other countries have their interests too and we can't keep fighting endless wars. Especially when they are outside of our own interests. I don't understand how she can say such a thing without hesitation, as if lives mean nothing? I don't know...
"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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  Quote hugoestr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:49
Hi, B.E.,

This has very little to do with real conservatives, and a lot to do with, for lack of a better word, "mainstream conservatives."

If we just focus on values, liberals and conservatives agree in most things, having a difference in opinion on how to achieve common goals.

Then these weird Lenin-inspired conservatives showed up and took over the GOP and the conservative media. They have twisted what being a conservative was about into the strange fascistic-religious mutant that mainstream conservative thought is today.

If we take a step back we can clearly see this. What real conservative, in their right mind, want to bankrupt the U.S.? Are those crickets I hear? None.

What conservative wants to destroy the U.S. military? None.

What conservative wants to ruin the U.S. economy? None.

Yet this is the platform that Palin/McCain are running on: another 4 years of Bush policies.

If democracy is about holding people accountable, we got to do it. The GOP has wrecked the country, hurt the military, bankrupted up, and weakened the economy. They must be held accountable.

Look, it is not really like much will change if Obama wins. The Republicans in Congress will make sure that nothing radical happens. And Obama is frankly very centrist.

But we got to send a clear message to the GOP leadership that they must go back to real conservatism, rather than doing everything for big corporations and war contractors and cover it with a thin varnish of religious and blue collar populism.

Edited by hugoestr - 12-Sep-2008 at 16:50
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:55
Originally posted by Leonidas

she is nuts. seriously out of all the people in the USA you throw up McPain and this muppet?
 
LOL  That has been a common refrain for over 30 years...ever since Jimmy Carter - Mr. Peanut.
 
 
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:58
hugo:
 
The GOP leadership IS big corporate interests, religious interests and blue collar populists.
 
There are far more blue collar populists to pander to than Ivy leaguers....and the Corporations have the money....what makes politics go.
 
Haven't you been paying attention for the last 28 years?  Wink
 
 


Edited by pikeshot1600 - 12-Sep-2008 at 17:01
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 16:59
Firstly,what conservative in the US and over here means are two different things.

i'd vote either way and have voted conservative before, gone the other way and if they can put up a decent option with a brain/no bigotry i would go there agian. Why would anyone stick to one party or one political line? it simply throws up even more rubbish  politicains and lazy policy. Swing voters, unsafe seats, always have had the power and the policy priorities.

As for voting policy wise, well it had to be big ticket stuff like; defense, economics and foreign policy (more so for the US) - if they are ok on two but really stink on one its a still a deal breaker. i stopped voting conservative initally over foregn policy and when they became too conseravtive in that US way domestically.

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  Quote Byzantine Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 17:08
Originally posted by hugoestr

This has very little to do with real conservatives, and a lot to do with, for lack of a better word, "mainstream conservatives."

If we just focus on values, liberals and conservatives agree in most things, having a difference in opinion on how to achieve common goals.

Then these weird Lenin-inspired conservatives showed up and took over the GOP and the conservative media. They have twisted what being a conservative was about into the strange fascistic-religious mutant that mainstream conservative thought is today.
 
I agree for the most part with this assessment. 
 
Real conservatism is definitely not represented in an accurate and fair light in the candidates the Republicans put up time after time for Congressional seats and the presidency.  Also, most of the mainstream media refuses to draw a distinction as you have between fake conservatices hijacking religious values to serve political purposes and real conservatives who happen to have a strong faith that informs and shapes their values.
 
It especially pains me to see how these fake conservatives (and some liberals) have used Christianity this way and have poisoned its witness in the eyes of those who watch the news and believe that they represent the ones who are bible-believing, loving, humble Christians.
 
Originally posted by hugoestr

If we take a step back we can clearly see this. What real conservative, in their right mind, want to bankrupt the U.S.? Are those crickets I hear? None.

What conservative wants to destroy the U.S. military? None.

What conservative wants to ruin the U.S. economy? None.

Yet this is the platform that Palin/McCain are running on: another 4 years of Bush policies.
 
Yes, as I said before, although there are some things which I think are good about McCain/Palin for real conservatives, I can't help but worry that they are just teasers to get us to vote them into office, only to have them become another Bush administration or worse.  At the same time, Obama definitely does not convince me or inspire me to vote for him.
 
Originally posted by hugoestr

But we got to send a clear message to the GOP leadership that they must go back to real conservatism, rather than doing everything for big corporations and war contractors and cover it with a thin varnish of religious and blue collar populism.
 
Yes, I totally agree, particularly with the bit about the religious varnish.  It must be tiresome and near cliche to hear this yet again, but neither party has the American people at heart, only the acquisition and maintenance of power.  The question remains: what do we, the true conservatives and liberals who care about the Republic and what it originally represented, do about it?
 
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 17:12
There seems to be the impression that policies decide elections.
 
TV (and now multi-media) and a physically attractive presence on the ticket; a fat war chest, and effective negative campaigning decide elections far more often.
 
Not always, but that is the way to bet.
 
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 17:36
Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy

I agree with Leonidas here.
 
When she said she would go to war with Russia if SHE felt it was necessary. That kind of scares me knowing she'd be second incharge and one step away from being number one.
 
She doesn't seem to understand that other countries have their interests too and we can't keep fighting endless wars. Especially when they are outside of our own interests. I don't understand how she can say such a thing without hesitation, as if lives mean nothing? I don't know...


I know the feeling. She is a bit too hasty with decision making... while this is all hypothetical, there is still a valid chance that it would turn into reality, which of course would not be a course our government should venture.
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 19:52
Originally posted by Byzantine Emperor

 
Again, let me reiterate.  I am not acting as a spokesperson for the McCain/Palin ticket.  There are those who are this type of sycophant on both sides. 
It's not a question of sycophancy but one of capability, competence and knowledge, as well as a set of priorities. When she was mayor and there was a choice between giving the town a ssewage works or a sports facility (or even a sewage factory and a reasonable sports facility) she chose a super sports complex. With local infrastructures crying out for improvement and windfall profits from oil available to the state that could have paid for it, she chose to distribute the windfall to the people in cash and borrow the money for the improvements. Which is little short of bribery.
She took a town with a balanced budget, and left it millions and millions in debt. This is conservatism?
This you want in a potential President?
What angers me is the hatred for anyone who might have the "conservative" label applied to them regardless of th issues that they stand for.
But no-one here is doing that. The problem with Palin is the issues she stands for. I really don't know how anyone could call her conservative without laughing.
Would any of you who are ripping the current representation of "conservative" (I do not think the ticket is worthy of being called this at all) be willing to consider someone else with the same label if they had some policies you could agree with?
I wouldn't be arguing the way I am if Huckabee had been the nominee. Probably not Ron Paul, though I didn't follow him as closely. For instance make it a choice between Huckabee and Christopher Hitchens I'd be out swinging for Huckabee.
 
Because, whatever his religious views (which of themselves don't concern me, and I don't think should ever even be mentioned), he does seem to have his head screwed on reasonably about the real world, and not be living in cloud-cuckoo land.
 
Incidentally I consider myself 'conservative' in any real sense of the word: it's just that pretty well every nationally known politician in the US is somewhat to the right of me.


Edited by gcle2003 - 12-Sep-2008 at 19:53
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 20:01
Originally posted by Byzantine Emperor

Also, most of the mainstream media refuses to draw a distinction as you have between fake conservatices hijacking religious values to serve political purposes and real conservatives who happen to have a strong faith that informs and shapes their values.
'Real conservatives' don't have to have a 'strong faith that informs and shapes their values' and moreover there's no reason why having a 'strong faith that informs and shapes their values' should make one conservative.
 
That is exactly the sort of supercilious condescension that makes one's blood boil. Especially as you are quite obviously usiing it as a codeword for 'Christianity', as if Christians had some sort of claim to be superior. Nobody of any faith - or lack of it - can make that claim.
 
Especially as any true American conservative should cherish the Constitution which makes it quite clear that there should be no religious barrier to public office.
 
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  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 20:04
Originally posted by pikeshot1600

There seems to be the impression that policies decide elections.
 
TV (and now multi-media) and a physically attractive presence on the ticket; a fat war chest, and effective negative campaigning decide elections far more often.
 
Not always, but that is the way to bet.
 
 
Nothing new. Check out for instance how many Presidents were elected when known to wear glasses? (Other than re-elected or when they were running as sitting VPs.)
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  Quote Byzantine Emperor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Sep-2008 at 20:05
Originally posted by gcle2003

It's not a question of sycophancy but one of capability, competence and knowledge, as well as a set of priorities. When she was mayor and there was a choice between giving the town a ssewage works or a sports facility (or even a sewage factory and a reasonable sports facility) she chose a super sports complex. With local infrastructures crying out for improvement and windfall profits from oil available to the state that could have paid for it, she chose to distribute the windfall to the people in cash and borrow the money for the improvements. Which is little short of bribery.
She took a town with a balanced budget, and left it millions and millions in debt. This is conservatism?
This you want in a potential President?
 
NO, I don't want EITHER ticket to be president!  How many times do I have to reiterate that I do not like either one, Obama/Biden or McCain/Palin.  The American people are being left in the dust no matter who becomes president.
 
As I mentioned earlier, this is what conservatives are stuck with, and Obama is what liberals are stuck with.  Although it is a difficult task, I have been trying to defend real conservative principles through the discussion of Palin. 
 
If I am defending her, it is only the few conservative values I think she might hold, as well as to show how much I dislike the modern media and their character assassinations.  Yeah, they might be telling the truth on a few points, but they are overwhelmingly in the tank for the far left and would savage any person with the conservative label on them, fake or real.
 
Originally posted by gcle2003

But no-one here is doing that. The problem with Palin is the issues she stands for. I really don't know how anyone could call her conservative without laughing.
 
Perhaps I am too cynical and pessimistic when it comes to politics, but still, I have a hard time believing that some people here would talk positively about or support a real conservative who puts theory into practice, just because they have conservative or Republican by their name.
 
Originally posted by gcle2003

I wouldn't be arguing the way I am if Huckabee had been the nominee. Probably not Ron Paul, though I didn't follow him as closely. For instance make it a choice between Huckabee and Christopher Hitchens I'd be out swinging for Huckabee.
 
Because, whatever his religious views (which of themselves don't concern me, and I don't think should ever even be mentioned), he does seem to have his head screwed on reasonably about the real world, and not be living in cloud-cuckoo land.
 
Well, there is something on which we agree.  I liked Huckabee a lot and had planned on supporting him if he made it out of the primary.  Unfortunately, that did not happen and look what we are stuck with!


Edited by Byzantine Emperor - 12-Sep-2008 at 20:19
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