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Riots in Tibet

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ulrich von hutten View Drop Down
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  Quote ulrich von hutten Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Riots in Tibet
    Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 06:13
The chinese repression of the tibetan people goes on.
Found a link among others. Please notice the comments ( burn chinese flags...)

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  Quote tommy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 08:24
Once Churchill said something liked that" Ithe main purposeof me to be the prime Minister is not to finish the British Empire:. Every Chinese leader has such feeling, not to finish the Chinese Empire, who can bear such dirty name, no one can, China lost much land since opium war, we cannot afford this thing to happen, even democratic government can appear in the future, still they will suppress independent movement of tibetCry
leung
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  Quote tommy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 08:32
the main reason is the high inflation rate, the price of food and other goods rise rapidly, just like other part of China, people burned the shop and bank, then you can see why
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 10:32
Er, Ulrich, read more closely, the attacks are targeted at migrants. Hardly the behaviour of oppressive peoples. Incidentally, you ever been to Tibet?
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 13:16
Originally posted by Sparten

Er, Ulrich, read more closely, the attacks are targeted at migrants. Hardly the behaviour of oppressive peoples. Incidentally, you ever been to Tibet?
these are Han colonist with a foreign language and culture and I'm certain they don't bother earn the language of the Tibetan nation. Soon enough the Tibetans will be a minority in their own land, so how does that not make them repressed?

 its not like they have a choice in the migrations or the politics.  This is the fault of Beijing trying to force the Han culture (via migration) onto a people that don't feel Chinese nor want to. PRC disrespecting of the whole Tibetan belief system and their wishes will only cause harm to themselves.

My heart goes out to the protesters and for Tibet.






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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 13:20
Actually , the largets number of migrants in Tibet are actually Ughur Muslims. Who seem to have been targeted especially.
 
So, Leo, tell me how many Aboriginal labguages do you speak?  How long do you have to live in an area to be a "native"?
 
All the best to the Chinese authorities in restoring order and safeguarding the lives and properties of people.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 13:24

Incidentally;

 
Burnt a mosque down. My my, attacking the symbols of Han domination are'nt they.  What next burn the Koran and the bible since they were symbols of Chairman Mao. And Confucius.
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 13:31


Anti-China protests erupt in Tibet


Violence erupted Friday in a busy market area of the Tibetan capital, Lhasa, as Buddhist monks and other ethnic Tibetans clashed with Chinese security forces. Witnesses say angry Tibetan crowds burned shops, cars, military vehicles and at least one tourist bus.

The chaotic scene was the latest, and most violent, confrontation in a series of protests that began Monday and now represent a major challenge to the ruling Communist Party as it prepares to play host to the Olympics in August.

Beijing is facing the most serious and prolonged demonstrations in the remote Himalayan region since the late 1980s, when it suppressed a rebellion there with lethal force that left scores and possibly hundreds of ethnic Tibetans dead.

The Dalai Lama, the exiled spiritual leader of Tibet, and his supporters around the world have embraced the protesters in Lhasa, and thousands of Buddhists in neighboring India and Nepal took to the streets Friday in sympathy.

Beijing is clearly alarmed that the wave of negative publicity could disrupt its elaborate plans for the Olympics and its hopes that the Games will showcase its rising influence and prosperity rather than domestic turmoil. Residents in Lhasa, reached by telephone, said the authorities had placed much of the city under a curfew by Friday night while military police were blocking many city streets. One resident reported seeing tanks in the center of the city.

he U.S. Embassy in Beijing warned American citizens on Friday not to travel to Lhasa. The embassy said it had "received firsthand reports from American citizens in the city who report gunfire and other indications of violence."

Xinhua, China's official news agency, issued a short statement in English confirming that shops in Lhasa had been set on fire and that other stores had closed because of the violence. But the protests otherwise received no coverage in the Chinese press.

The Dalai Lama released a statement on Friday calling on both sides to avoid violence and appealing to the Chinese leadership to "address the long simmering resentment of the Tibetan people through dialogue with the Tibetan people."

The situation in Lhasa represents a complicated predicament for the Communist Party, which is now holding its annual meeting of the National People's Congress in Beijing. Party leaders are grappling with growing criticism of China's domestic rights record and its ties to Sudan, which the United States has accused of waging a genocidal campaign in its Darfur region.

Just as Beijing sees the Olympics as a chance to strut confidently on the world stage, so its opponents see the international publicity ahead of the Games as a chance to press deep grievances against the one-party state.

In the past, China has not hesitated to crush major protests in Tibet or jail disobedient monks. President Hu Jintao, who is also general secretary of the Communist Party, served as party boss in Tibet during a violent crackdown against protests in 1989. His support for the bloody suppression of unrest that year earned him the good will of Deng Xiaoping, then the paramount leader, and led directly to his elevation to the Politburo Standing Committee and eventually to China's top leadership posts.

But Chinese leaders may be more reluctant to order such heavy-handed tactics as Beijing prepares to host the Olympics. On Friday, different accounts emerged about how Chinese military police in Lhasa handled the demonstrations.

Radio Free Asia, a nonprofit news agency financed by the U.S. government, quoted Tibetan witnesses who described Chinese police officers firing into crowds of protesters and killing at least two people in the city's ancient Barkhor area. Other accounts from Tibetans suggested that the police had also attacked Buddhist monks.

But a Chinese resident, reached by telephone, said stories were spreading among Chinese residents that soldiers had been injured and had not been allowed to fight back against Tibetans throwing rocks. Another Chinese man living near the Barkhor area said family members told him that two soldiers died and that Tibetans were beating Chinese residents with iron rods.

The sharp escalation in violence Friday, and the sense of dread described by several residents, came a day after the Chinese Foreign Ministry said that the situation in Lhasa had stabilized. The protest started Monday when Buddhist monks began peaceful demonstrations against religious restrictions by the Chinese authorities. The police arrested 50 or 60 monks, but other protests followed on Tuesday and Wednesday as monks in two different monasteries took to the streets.

The apparent epicenter of protests Friday was the Tromsikhang Market, a massive, concrete structure built in the Barkhor area of Lhasa by the Chinese authorities in the early 1990s.

"It's chaos in the streets," said a person who answered the telephone at a bread shop near the market.

What actually sparked the violence is unclear, as accounts differed between Chinese and Tibetan residents. Monks from the Ramoche Temple, located a short walk from the market, reportedly began to march in the Barkhor area.

The Ramoche monks intended to protest the rough treatment of monks who had marched earlier in the week, according to a Tibetan activist in the United States who has communicated with people in Lhasa.

When police officers began beating the monks, ordinary Tibetans rioted in the Barkhor area, the activist said. Angry mobs set fire to a police car and a store owned by a Chinese shopkeeper, the activist said.

But a Chinese travel agent in Lhasa, reached by telephone, said Tibetans had instigated the violence and set fire to an empty tour bus parked outside the Ramoche Temple. Another Chinese resident described 50 or 60 young Tibetans burning stores owned by Chinese merchants as well as two fire trucks and two police cars.

"I saw someone who was dead and covered in a sheet," the Chinese resident said in a telephone interview. "The Tromsikhang market was destroyed, except for the shops owned by Tibetans. I heard a soldier shouting, 'Please go home and stop fighting!' "

News agencies also reported clashes between monks from Ramoche Temple and military police. "The monks are still protesting," a witness told The Associated Press. "Police and army cars were burned. There are people crying. Hundreds of people, including monks and civilians are in the protests."

Radio Free Asia reported that Tibetan protesters were waving traditional white scarves and shouting, "Free Tibet." The agency said the riots began about 10 a.m. and had largely quieted down by 3:30 p.m. after paramilitary police were mobilized.

Meanwhile, anxious tourists stranded in Lhasa posted worried comments on online forums for travelers. "The situation seems to be very nervous and paranoid up here," wrote one person in broken English in a chat room sponsored by the Lonely Planet tour guide. "There is police and military everwhere. Suddenly you would see some policeman running and rushig (sic) somewhere."

The ethnic friction evident in the violence Friday has long simmered just below the surface in Lhasa. For more than two decades, a steady influx of Chinese migrants has transformed and stratified the city.

The protests in Lhasa coincided with the anniversary of a failed 1959 Tibetan uprising against Chinese rule that forced the Dalai Lama to flee to India.

Huang Yuanxi, Zhang Jing and Jake Hooker contributed research from Beijing, and Steven Lee Myers and Graham Bowley contributed reporting from New York. Somini Sengupta contributed reporting from India.


iht.com



http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/in_pictures/7297228.stm






www.nytimes.com

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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 13:48
Originally posted by Sparten

Actually , the largets number of migrants in Tibet are actually Ughur Muslims. Who seem to have been targeted especially.
 
So, Leo, tell me how many Aboriginal labguages do you speak?  How long do you have to live in an area to be a "native"?
 
by the time i came here they were long gone from my area, if you want to trip up an Australian over native rights your talking to the wrong one, I fully support all rights they are asking for plus more.  ...you see i use  that very argument against any Anglo that bitches about WOGS like me.


All the best to the Chinese authorities in restoring order and safeguarding the lives and properties of people.
thats like 'all the best for isreali troops' in the west bank, but hey isreali's are native by your logic and therefore such behavior completely reasonableThumbs%20Down

Edit:
this video is of PRC border guards shooting Tibetan pilgrims on their way to see the Dalia lama. 'safeguarding the lives' as Spartan will call it.




Edited by Leonidas - 15-Mar-2008 at 14:04
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 14:09
China should get out of Tibet.
Perhaps a good complot at the Olympics could help them to understand
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  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 14:20
one (small) persons first hand account and pictures are here
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 16:18
This is all fine coming from the inhabitants of nations that had carte blanche in eras past to colonise, rape and pillage other countries to their heart's content and still do under  pretences of human rights and democracy.   The humanitarian Germans supplied Saddam with finished chemical weapons which they held onto from their Nazi past and they were foremost in stirring the ethnic troubles in Yugoslavia - show some outrage.  It seems that only repressive countries within spheres of their competition only ever come under such scrutiny, where is the outrage at the treatment of Iraqis, Kurds, Afghans, Palestinians and others?   Or are they free game as long as the civilised allies are doing the killing?
 
China's policy is completely wrong but I think your concerns should be directed closer to home.  Lavrov was spot on.
 
Russia Accuses U.S. of Double Standards on Rights (Update1)

By Michael Heath

March 13 (Bloomberg) -- Russia said the U.S. State Department's ``latest opus'' on human rights reflects the double standards of a country that uses the issue as a foreign policy tool while failing to examine its own actions.

The Foreign Ministry said in a statement it rejects criticism of Russia's human rights record from a country that ``has in effect legalized torture, uses capital punishment on minors and denies responsibility for war crimes and human rights violations in Iraq and Afghanistan.''

The U.S. report, published two days ago, said President Vladimir Putin's centralization of power in the Kremlin, selective law enforcement and restrictions on aid groups and the media have eroded government accountability. The Foreign Ministry called it ``a hackneyed set of claims.''

Ties between the U.S. and Russia have been strained over the past year by the possible further expansion of NATO into former Soviet republics, American plans to set up missile shield sites in Poland and the Czech Republic and President George W. Bush's support for Kosovo's independence.

The government in Moscow says the moves are part of an effort to isolate Russia and says the U.S. has violated international law when it suits American interests.

Moscow Talks

U.S. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Defense Secretary Robert Gates will visit Moscow on March 17-18 for talks on missile defense, non-proliferation and counter- terrorism, the White House said yesterday.

White House spokeswoman Dana Perino said Bush and Putin agreed on the meeting in a telephone conversation last week.

Russia has accused the U.S. of sponsoring popular uprisings against flawed elections in the former Soviet republics of Georgia and Ukraine to install pro-American leaders. Both countries want to join the North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

``The U.S. uses the struggle to spread democracy and the defense of human rights as a cover'' to advance its interests, the ministry said in the statement issued late yesterday.

Putin, in a May 9, 2007, speech in Red Square marking the Soviet victory over Nazi Germany, suggested U.S. foreign policy resembled that of Adolf Hitler's Third Reich.

The president has warned western countries not to interfere in Russia's affairs and demanded it be treated as an equal. The Foreign Ministry echoed that sentiment, criticizing what it called the ``mentorish tone'' of the State Department report.

The ministry said the report was prejudiced, mistaken, poorly sourced and counterproductive.

``Many passages are copied from previous reports; the impression is that the State Department simply collected facts to suit the conclusions formulated in advance,'' it said.

To contact the reporter on this story: Michael Heath in Sydney at mheath1@bloomberg.net

Last Updated: March 13, 2008 06:23 EDT
 
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  Quote Styrbiorn Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 17:14
Originally posted by Zagros

This is all fine coming from the inhabitants of nations that had carte blanche in eras past to colonise, rape and pillage other countries to their heart's content and still do under  pretences of human rights and democracy.   The humanitarian Germans supplied Saddam with finished chemical weapons which they held onto from their Nazi past and they were foremost in stirring the ethnic troubles in Yugoslavia - show some outrage.  It seems that only repressive countries within spheres of their competition only ever come under such scrutiny, where is the outrage at the treatment of Iraqis, Kurds, Afghans, Palestinians and others?   Or are they free game as long as the civilised allies are doing the killing?
 
China's policy is completely wrong but I think your concerns should be directed closer to home.  Lavrov was spot on.
 
I don't really see what you are complaining about. The new generation of Germans has nothing to do with the Nazis. 
 
And outrage? About 10,000,000 (2,000,000 people in London alone) marched in the 15th February 2003 protests against the invasion of Iraq. That's several magnitudes more of people than those complaining on Tibet...
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  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 17:43

In that case I must not have been clear enough, my apologies (though i am not sure how you think Saddam could have been supplied by the Nazis as you think i inferred) - the current generation of Germans SUPPLIED Nazi era chemical weapons to Saddam.  For example the issue of Saddam's use of these weapons against Kurds wasn't a big issue in mainstream media until it was used as one of the excuses for regime change in Iraq, that is the sort of thing I am talking about.  It's not Ulrich's fault because he only reacts to what he's exposed to and he is exposed selectively to the oppression of those suffering at the hands of the West's primary competitors and imperial targets.

And those people marched against an unjustifiable war, I don't rmember much public outrage about Saddam using the weapons supplied to him by the benevolent allies against Kurds.  The people who get most attention from the list I gave are the palestinians but that is thanks to strong elements in the Arab world bringing their plight to light.


Edited by Zagros - 15-Mar-2008 at 17:44
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  Quote Gundamor Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 18:13
The Chinese only recognize strength. They'll quickly crush this and things will be back to normal by next week. Its funny that a lot of major U.S. media and government outlets are kind of keeping this on the side not at the front of news. It shows how much of an economic stranglehold the Chinese have over the U.S. and how the U.S. government is walking on eggshells when it has to deal with the Chinese government especially with Taiwan elections looming.




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  Quote Mughal e Azam Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 19:27
An internal problem for China.


Edited by Mughaal - 15-Mar-2008 at 20:40
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  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 20:03
Originally posted by Zagros

The humanitarian Germans supplied Saddam with finished chemical weapons which they held onto from their Nazi past and they were foremost in stirring the ethnic troubles in Yugoslavia - show some outrage.


LOL where did you get that from? the Sun?
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 20:39
Originally posted by Leonidas

thats like 'all the best for isreali troops' in the west bank, but hey isreali's are native by your logic and therefore such behavior completely reasonableThumbs%20Down

This is the Chinese Army operating in Chinese Territory. That is the Israelites operating in occupied territory. Big diff. Incidentally, the army has'nt as yet been called out, the police are handling it. If this was a commonwealth country there would have the army out now.
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  Quote Spartakus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 20:44
What is this? Whenever an article is brought about an Asian Country, European countries and, always, the USA are being accused off by members with specific orientation and of specific origin. Now, this is spamming. If you have any complaints about USA or Germany's behaviour, then be my guess and open a relevant topic. But do not spam in other topics. We talk about China here, not Iraq, Palestine ,Germany. Personally, i did not came to this topic to learn about Saddam and him being supplied by Western countries, but about China.

Edited by Spartakus - 15-Mar-2008 at 20:45
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Mar-2008 at 20:47
Edit:
this video is of PRC border guards shooting Tibetan pilgrims on their way to see the Dalia lama. 'safeguarding the lives' as Spartan will call it.


Lol. My god Leo that was priceless! I don't know what was funnier, the guy hiding in that makeshift toilet (who incidentally, knew English) or the pilgrims deciding to make a journey through the worst mountains in the world, which are crawling with Chinese soldiers on one end, and Indians on the other, especially when Tibet is an autonomous region and travl with India is fairly easy, especially into Ladkak or NEFA. Or maybe it was the guy filiming from a kilometer telling us what happened.
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