in a coventional war who would have won u

you are still talking about the aircrafts that were not in Europe......

Originally posted by Maximus Germanicus I I don't doubt that the Russians could make it to the Rhine but that is where they had lose, they then would be in a protracted war with NATO and they could not sustain it. For the Russians to win they need to take the COGs of NATO (Paris and London) only then would a peace be brokered, they couldn't so WP would lose.

Edited by Cryptic - 15-Jul-2010 at 08:53

You might well be correct Mosquito? But, on what front would the WP armour attack? If it was directed across the mostly flat Northern plains, then the range superiority of the West would have again the edge!

Other directions of attack, would it seems place these armoured columns within large valleys, or having to cross large high ridges, or go around them! Again, wire guided anti-tank and anti-helo missisiles seem to be more important to the defender rather than the agressor! The defender already has his defensive positions marked and known like the back of his hand! And, I am sure "pre-ranging" of the cannon and tank cannon had already been calibrated to a "T!"

As I said earlier, it is my belief that the NATO forces had planned upon forcing WP forces into a field of fire from which they could not escape!

But, of course they could have been wrong, much like me?

Also, I might well suggest that large portions of Germany's vast highway system, might also have been reserved for both supply and runway support?

It also seems that the "kingfish" missile, had but a range of 185 miles or so! It seems that the outer defensive ring of a carrier fleet, whould have a long time to interfer with the bombers! Not even mentioning that these bombers would quite likely have no fighter support! It can also be considered that Western jamming, and other devices, might well have been more advanced that Soviet guidance systems?

So, outer ring of smaller crusiers, f-14's, FA-18's, and ship to air missiles? It might have been interesting?

Regards,

Edited by opuslola - 15-Jul-2010 at 09:48

Originally posted by opuslola You might well be correct Mosquito? But, on what front would the WP armour attack? If it was directed across the mostly flat Northern plains, then the range superiority of the West would have again the edge! Other directions of attack, would it seems place these armoured columns within large valleys, or having to cross large high ridges, or go around them! Again, wire guided anti-tank and anti-helo missisiles seem to be more important to the defender rather than the agressor! The defender already has his defensive positions marked and known like the back of his hand! And, I am sure "pre-ranging" of the cannon and tank cannon had already been calibrated to a "T!" As I said earlier, it is my belief that the NATO forces had planned upon forcing WP forces into a field of fire from which they could not escape! But, of course they could have been wrong, much like me? Also, I might well suggest that large portions of Germany's vast highway system, might also have been reserved for both supply and runway support? Regards,

And neither do I Mosquito!

But, speaking of wire guided anti-tank weapons, watch this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwSCsV2rGY8

Regards,

Originally posted by opuslola And neither do I Mosquito! But, speaking of wire guided anti-tank weapons, watch this; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwSCsV2rGY8 Regards,

This is nothing... the French made a far better one. Watch this.. but to the end pls :

Before I let this go, I would like to point out again that my sources, indicated that the US Inteligence networks, figured out quite early that most WP divisions, were always more like "Potemkin villiages" than a real division! Always a lack of spare parts, routine maintainence mostly ignored, reports falsified all the way to the top, etc.!

Thus, on paper, and within the Kremlin walls, the WP was armed to the teeth, but when a "push" came to a "shove", they could not produce an effective division anywhere! Theft from army and air force supplies was a never ending thing, and since many division leaders were profiting from it, it was never really stopped!

My sources tended to think of everthing as in reality being about one half of what could have been used (by the WP forces), would really be usable in a combat situation!

Much the same could be said about the large number of Soviet ICBM's! These are very sensitive implements of war, and need a great deal of regular inspection and maintanence or they just will not work! Given the average moral of WP troops, it was expected that much of this work was merely done on paper!

I a nuke world war, I think the USA did not expect one half of the Soviet ICMB's would make it out of their holes, and much less hit a target thousands of miles away!

But, again, sources are merely sources!

You've got yours and I have mine, and Max has his!

Flicking through Hackettls Third World War of which I have a copy he gives the figure of 1150 fighters in Europe for the US alone, approx 1/2 of all NATO Fighters in Europe.

Can you identify these Mosquito? Were they F16's F14's et al?


Edited by DreamWeaver - 15-Jul-2010 at 10:25

Of course here are the ones that the French wish you would watch!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H1u7iWVfdY&feature=related

Regarde' vous!

Training Exercise "Seven Days to the River Rhine"
Part of Cold War
Date 1979 Location NATO/Warsaw Pact border in Germany Result Unknown; never attempted. Territorial changes West Germany east of River Rhine to the Warsaw Pact
Belligerents
Warsaw Pact	North Atlantic Treaty Organisation
Commanders
N/A	January-June: Gen. Alexander M Haig, Jr, June- December: General Bernard B. Rogers, (SACEUR)
Casualties and losses
If carried out, most of the Polish population (a estimated 2,000,000 immediate Polish deaths near the Vistula river) and possibly many East Germans.	If carried out, heavy losses in West Germany, amongst others.

Now this is scary