QuoteReplyTopic: Turkic Peoples Posted: 12-Aug-2007 at 09:21
Originally posted by omergun
IM A TRK, AND THATS IS THE REASON I LIVE FOR, THATS THE REASON I CAN ENJOY THIS LIFE, BEING TRK IS MY BIGGEST TREASURE, LOVE, PROUD AND HONOUR, you dont have any doubts about that.
Do you realize how laughable and foolish that sounds?
IM A TRK, AND THATS IS THE REASON I LIVE FOR, THATS THE REASON I CAN ENJOY THIS LIFE, BEING TRK IS MY BIGGEST TREASURE, LOVE, PROUD AND HONOUR, you dont have any doubts about that.
Do you realize how laughable and foolish that sounds?
I dont see anything laughable thing in here, but i think for people like you, whom dont know anything about love for their nation, it is quite normal to think these words are laughable. You are not used to these kind of thoughts, for me people like you are the ones who are laughable. If you dont have anything to say about the subject, then dont write, dont soil the topic with your dirt.
Well, If Anatolian people have no Altaic genes then it means they are not Turks. Therefore, Central Asian people are the only society that can be defined as Turks. But, this is the most idiotic idea i have ever heard. Because being a nation is not about genes or other racist materials in today's world.
I'm a Turkmen. We are living in Anatolia. And I'm seeing lots of people who seems like Armenians, Greeks or Slavs but they accept that they are Turks. They don't look like my family but I'm from the same nation with them. So what makes us a nation? The answer is exactly CULTURE.
Now, think about Central Asia. People of Turkistan speak similar languages with me. They are all muslims. Their traditions are just like my family's. So what is the difference between them and me?
Well, if it just a question of a personal choice, then you should also stop repeating that this nation definetely exists and every Turkic person who doesn't believe in it is a "Mankurt"
Do you even know what a "Mankurt" is...You say you've read Chinghiz Aytamov, how about the"The Day Lasts More Than a Hundred Years", somebody who cannot speak his/her language, is lost and forgets his/her history and motherland is a mankurt.
This term is used in Turkic regions for those who do the above.
Its a question of their personal choice if they wish to be as such and those who do are a "Mankurt", a person can choose whether to be one or not.
Sarmat
Right, but it's also the view of most of the scientists, historians and linguists.
There is no clear consensus regarding the matter, its not a mathmatical equation, different people can have different opinions.
Sarmat
You even didn't know what is the proper name of the president of Kazakhstan.
How childish...
Who doesn't know the proper name of the president, its hardly a big secret only known to experts now is it
Sarmat
Yes, I do, because I think "nation" is more or less a scientific notion and not smth. vague based on views of some leaders.
Nations are shaped and formed by leaders, now when we consider the fact that Turkic states share alot in common whether it be linguistically, historically etc if their leaders start moving closer together ofcourse this will have a big influence on the masses.
Today we are living in a globalised world, boundries are being broken, the problems of communications due to geographical distance is no longer an issue, as a result of advances in technology we can now all watch each other's Tv channels, mix on the internet, access media and so forth.
This is already having a large impact between the Turkic states in the first 20 years of independance.
If Turkic intellects and leaders percieve their similarities and ties to be more important than their differences this is up to them and they have every right to do so.
The_TURK
Now, think about Central Asia. People of Turkistan speak similar languages with me. They are all muslims. Their traditions are just like my family's. So what is the difference between them and me?
Exactly, as I wrote above it depends on the person.
A Turk from Afganistan can decide, these other Turks their language is similar to mine, we share historical connections, have the same epics and legends, were both muslim so were brothers of same nation and religion.
However, another Turk may decide, we have some similarities but also differences, I focus on differences and so don't consider anybody similar.
A Turk from any Turkic region has the option to be a Turk, have a regional identity, or have both identities. For example an "Afshar" Oghuz-Turkmen Turk from Iran can refer to him/herself as just an Afshar, or just as an Iranian, or as an Afshar Turk or Iran Turk or just Turk. Just like there are "Salur" Oghuz-Turkmen Turks in Eastern Turkestan, Afganistan, Turkmenistan, Iran, Azerbaycan and Turkey.
Edited by Bulldog - 20-Aug-2007 at 12:21
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
Albert Pine
Well, then according to you a Kazakh who speaks only his language and loves his culture, but doesn't think that he is one nation with Turkey Turks is Mankurt in your view, right?
The problem is that you consider everybody who doesn't believe in your Turk nation a Mankurt. However, different Turkic people can perfectly know their roots and culture, but do not consider themselves one nation with other Turkic speakers. Stupid to deny that, and they are not Mankurts.
And perhaps you even didn't know that Chinghiz Aitmatov wrote that novel in RUSSIAN language and it's a part of mandatory Russian literature course in in Russian schools. And the term "Mankurt" is often used among the educated people in Russia as well.
Well, then according to you a Kazakh who speaks only his language and loves his culture, but doesn't think that he is one nation with Turkey Turks is Mankurt in your view, right?
Wrong.
That is his/her personal preferance, a Kazak can refer to his/herself as just a Kazak and also as a Kazak Turk, this option is always open whether somebody wishes to use it or not.
Sarmat
The problem is that you consider everybody who doesn't believe in your Turk nation a Mankurt.
Your making wrong assumptions, I never said anything of the sort and already explained what a "Mankurt" is. Somebody who disgaress with me merely has a different point of view, however, a Mankurt is an individual who has forgotten the mothertongue, history, motherland and is devoid of his/her own culture.
Sarmat
However, different Turkic people can perfectly know their roots and culture, but do not consider themselves one nation with other Turkic speakers.
Some do, some don't
However, they all have the right to use or percieve themselves to be part of the "Turk" identity if they wish, this option is open.
I enjoy reading Chingiz Aytamovs novels and also his articles and views regarding developing and boosting Turkic countries ties and relations.
What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
Albert Pine
Sorry, if I misunderstood you. I just had an impression that you are very negative about the Turkic people, who don't want to be the part of one "Turk nation"
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