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Diana; The People's Princess remembered

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  Quote QueenCleopatra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Diana; The People's Princess remembered
    Posted: 21-Jul-2007 at 14:03
 
Diana,%20Princess%20of%20Wales,%20with%20sons
 
For me Diana is both an icon and an inspiration. I was 11 when she died but even then I knew she was a special person and that her loss was something that would not easily be forgotten nor accepted.
 
Even as the 10th anniversary of death comes closer she is loved as much today as she was  when she stood on the balcony with Prince Charles as a 19 year old all those years.
 
Yes she was flawed but who isn't? It's tragic how such a beautiful and spirited woman could suffer such crippling insecurities about herself.
 
I think that her appeal is how she was able to see that there were many people far worse off than she and she always made time to do her bit even if it was just to smile at a dying child or shake hands with an AIDS victim when no-one else would.
 
I though I'd open a tribute thread as it is both the 10th anniversary of her death and what would have been her 46th birthday.
 
RIP Diana, you're still loved and missed.


Edited by QueenCleopatra - 21-Jul-2007 at 14:14
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jul-2007 at 02:53
Ah yes, the princess who was flawed to some but perfect to the many. How could such a spirit ever die? No! she lives on for us all. The insecurities are of one who had not fully realized her place in history. Yet, there always will be a special place in our hearts and in our heads for those with that special light of kindness that glows through the gloomy darkness of world affairs. She somehow, even if for a short while, can reach out, take us by the hand  and lead to the place where she now belongs.
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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22-Jul-2007 at 17:28

I'll feel sad for anyone who dies in such a tragic accident, regardless of whoever's womb they came out of.

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  Quote Constantine XI Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 01:37
Honestly I don't buy the whole sensationalist media campaign to turn her into some tragic fairytale. They made her out to be some ordinary gal who could have grown up on the same street as you and was married into a cold and stuffy family in which she was so cruelly victimised. What a bunch of baloney.
 
She was from one of the most aristocratic families in all of England, and if anyone knew what to expect from marrying into royalty it would be them. The strict protocol, need for public dignity and composure and the like were all very much familiar to Diana from a young age. And much as the seemingly shy woman appears to bat her eyes at the camera at times, she played the media and she knew she was good at it. Every time she wished to inflict some form of grief upon the royals she could turn to the media to completely blow something out of proportion and get the gullible tabloid reading public of the world to bleed their hearts in sorrow for her. It is no wonder the in-laws were glad to be rid of her.
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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 03:23
I agree Constantine XI - but I wasn't counting on anyone else to give a reply as similar to mine (Abiet a little bit longer) and frankly, what saddens me is that this shows the effect that mass media and the tabloids can have against an ordinary human being. This is my mind is just one case out of the thousands against the monarchy - that it's just not fair to subject someone to that amount of pressure. That kind of pressure doesn't create balanced individuals who will do a good job of "representing" my country.
 
Also, although it's sad what happened to her, I don't think that one can call her a huge advocater in the war against poverty - she gave some money and hugged some children. Sure, there wasn't much else she was allowed to do being a royal, but those people who go into Africa, right into the fray and help in hospitals and aid missions - they are the heroes, not Diana, and I think that many sensible aid workers would be offended by that amount of attention she gets for being "an aid to global poverty".
 
...Also, "The people's princess"? That's throughly oxymoronic because the entire concept of monarchy goes against such a socialist term like that. In a country in which were a known officially as "the subjects" rather than "the citizens".
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 03:52
Ah, but it is already admitted that Diana was flawed. This is women's history which is not the same as mens. Every girl at some time dreams of being a princess. Having a modern day role model furthered the female cause for every female could look at her and say there is a bit of me in the way she lived her life. Some males will never understand!
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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 03:56

No offense, but that's a tad pretenious, Elenos - the fact that this is the women's history section doesn't at all dismiss my points. The fact that she was a woman doesn't make my points different at all. And neither does the fact that I, a man, an writing this.

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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 04:28
I realize that Earl Aster, yet women are women and we are but mere men!
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  Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 04:52

This is, lets not forget, a thread set up as a tribute, so it would be more respectful to QueenCleopatra not to 'soil' her thread. I must say, just like the Madeleine McCann case, Diana's story was manipulated to sell papers and news stories, but that did not take away from the little girl, and nor does it take away from Diana. Can anybody actually name what she, herself did wrong? It is the Diana that the media created that we all actually have the problem with, she didn't walk down the street wanting to be referred as the 'people's princess', nor did she choose the family she was born into.

A tragic death of a mother, a sister, and a person who did more, if not a huge amount, than practically all in her priviledged position.

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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 05:00
The death of anyone like that is sad. No matter who they are.
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 05:32
To explain things further, we all have to learn for I didn't know at one time,  when on a thread that is a "shrine" to the memory of a person, particularly a woman, the etiquette is not to so much mention the death but the life. 

Edited by elenos - 23-Jul-2007 at 05:38
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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 05:58

...Yes, that's what I'm doing Elenos- saying what I thought about her life. I'm not being disrespectful, but since this is a history forum, nothing is exempt from examination. Things become dangerous if you can't constructivley question them.

What people say the most important part of her life was, was that she was a monarch. As a republican, I'm of course sad that she died as a human being, but not particularly because she was a monarch. That's irrelivant to me.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 06:25
What did she do wrong, lets see, adultry, blackmail. washing a familys dirty linen in public........ etc, etc.
 
A prime example of media manufacturing.
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 06:33
I understand your position Earl Aster and am not into rules as well, but there are occasions we we are not really in the position to question just go along with it. As you say we are on a history site and therefore into learning. To constructively question is normal, but we need be constructive in ways that encourage others to contribute in their own special ways.
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  Quote Dolphin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 07:05
Originally posted by Sparten

What did she do wrong, lets see, adultry, blackmail. washing a familys dirty linen in public........ etc, etc.
 
A prime example of media manufacturing.
 
Don't agree at all. Charles and Diana were seperated when she got together with Dodi, Charles himself had cheated on her on numerous occasions and had always been in love with Camilla. He even said ' oh it depends on what you mean by love..' when he was asked just weeks after marrying Diana, with her beside him, if he loved her. Washing dirty linen in public..? What, speaking candidly about the most secretive family in Britain? So what? It was her nature to speak candidly and not become embroiled in the inward lies and hypocricy of royalty..Blackmail? Where's your evidence for that?
 
The woman was of course turned into a veritable angel by the media, which she wasn't. She was human, arrogant, rich and spoilt, but she was still an over-ridingly good person. That is why I refuse to confuse the problem I have with the media treatment of her with the actual person herself, a person who is no more, or less, faulted than the rest of us. I personally think it is unfair to dismiss her as a person because she doesn't meet the requirements of the false media image that was created around her. She was Diana, the media created the 'People's Princess'.
 
Look at Madeleine McCann. There is no doubt that the media frenzy that surrounded her dissappearance was a key factor in her not being found, because she would have become too 'hot' to sell on into child pornography, or to be sold into illegal adoption. Hot potato? Inter-continental police action? Get rid of the child. Kill and hide. My point is that, despite the fact that I think the media were totally irresponsible, and distorted and manipulated the image and story of the girl, I'm not going to start thinking differently of her, she just was, just like Diana. Their media distortion should not make them any less worthy of pity or admiration, and Diana, just like others who have died, should be remembered for the good in her life, because it is too easy to judge a life you haven't lived.
 
We all have skeletons, just because she was in the constant public eye doesn't mean it is our right to pull it out of the cupboard and stamp over it in judgement, with a disregard to her family. She should be judged as a human being, not against the angelic distortion of her that she never wanted or embraced in the first place. She never said she was perfect, so lets dwell on her good points, instead of looking for some intellectual rebuttal against the general public admiration for the sake of it.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 07:42
I make no comments about her personality. I did not know. What I am annoyed at the fact that a lady whose death was no doubt tragic, was made out to be some sort of saint, which she certainly was not, by her own admission,  and the fact she was voted 3rd greatest Briton, made be gaggle.
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  Quote elenos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 08:25
The limitations and weaknesses of royalty got underlined by this modern saga. I'm into all this myself and have lots of opinions, but wonder if this is the appropriate thread. I hope Queen Cleopatra will forgive us, but we are talking about the life of Diana, she still is a talking point after all this time.

Everybody has an opinion here, so I can't say how history will remember Diana,  but it is still is an evolving situation with lots of drama iinvolved and what a story to tell. I cannot think of anything in British history to compare where an actual princess is involved. So in that way it is unique. Many young girls get a "princess complex" where they imagine themselves as a princess. I believe Freud first mentioned this, as I'm trying to say there is a deeper side at work here.

At one time people asked of royalty is this the person or is this the image? Here the solid life we can believe. Through the modern media we can refer to the her life over an extended period rather than a series of isolated incidents. Plenty of room here for both fantasy and reality. 
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  Quote Aster Thrax Eupator Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 11:22
I believe that Royalty is the image - that's one of the reasons why I am so strongly against it. People because of their bloodlines are forced into adopting this image and way of life without having a choice. Even if they want to give it all up, they can't because the press still chase them.
 
Also, Dolphin, you can't really compare the stories of Madeline McCann and Diana- one is a child who never developed a personality whilst the other was a grown woman with her own history. Diana has plenty of stuff in her life that we can comment on and analyse - Madeline McCann was so young that she didn't (I say didn't because I believe that she is probably dead, sadly enough).
 
She never said she was perfect, so lets dwell on her good points, instead of looking for some intellectual rebuttal against the general public admiration for the sake of it.
 
Having an intellectual rebuttal "for the sake of it" is a little oxymoronic - an intellectual debate would not be "for the sake of it", and my points against Diana were not "for the sake of it".
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  Quote QueenCleopatra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 13:54
Look I didn't intend to start an argument. I was actually interested in paying tribute to a woman who despite her own personal trials reached to those far worse off than she.  I just wanted to give deserved rememberance to a woman who inspired me even as a child.
 
I'm NOT saying her death was tragic only because of her status. I'm saying it was tragic because it was the untimely loss a woman who although insecure and in a way lonely had real empathy with people and a heart of gold.
 
I suppose there will always be those few who think she was nothing more than a pretty face but being flawed DOES NOT equal being a bad person.
 
Diana could not help having insecurities and being needy. It was just how she was. She didn't ask for it. And she just dealt with it in her own way.
 
But again she is an inspiration because she came out of her marriage and the stuffy life of royalty more or else in one piece and she never forgot those less fortunate than she.
 
To listen to some you'd swear the poor Princess was some manic depressive media whore with nothing but air between her ears!

Yes Diana was flawed but who isn't? I'm sure even Mother Tereasa and Gandhi were flawed in some way.

Show me one person who says they're perfect and I show you a liar.

Yes she was Bulimic, yes she suffered severe insecurities and depression, yes she craved attention, yes she cut herself though not severely but she is not to be judged for that.

All she wanted was for Charles to love her as much as she loved him. He didn'(not his fault. He didn't ask to fall in love with Camilla) and her disorders were her way of reacting to that as well as being the product of her troubled childhood.

But yet through all her personal suffering Diana still realised that there were people far worse off than she and she found the time to do her bit.

Even her presence was soothing for those needy worldwide.I bet that shaking hands with AIDS victim ment much more to him than any amount of money she could have given to the cause.

And the fact that she did it because she really believed in her causes and and real empathy with people shouldn't be forgotten.

Diana gave more to the people than they realised till after she was gone. She didn't even realise it herself which makes her life and death all the more tragic.

to quote Elton John

" We'll miss the wings of your compassion more than you will ever know"
 
And as to the person who critized her being called The People's Princess, like it or not she was. She brought a human face to the monarchy and she was some-one the ordinary people could relate to, a young Mother in a troubled marriage being forced to live a life in which she had to hide a lot of herself. And she loved by the people to this day because of.
 
She wasn't the People's Princess for nothing.

People really need to learn a little respect.


Edited by QueenCleopatra - 23-Jul-2007 at 14:34
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  Quote morticia Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jul-2007 at 14:31
May she rest in peace! I'm not sympathetic towards any of the monarchies with their stuffy and controlling protocols, but no one deserves to die at such a young age, especially being the healthy and lively young woman that she was. Being in the center of media attention 24-7 cannot be easy or healthy for anyone. Also remember that she had advisors and people who told her how to act, where to go, how to dress, etc. I don't call that much of an independent life, so I don't think anyone ever really knew the real Diana - I don't think Diana knew who Diana really was. Again, may she rest in peace.   

Edited by morticia - 23-Jul-2007 at 14:32
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