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The "welfare state"?

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warwolf1969 View Drop Down
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  Quote warwolf1969 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The "welfare state"?
    Posted: 19-Jul-2010 at 10:06
The modern welfare state is designed to catch those people who fall through the cracks of society.  When you have a world that requires money to live you need some way to provide for those that may not be able to earn such money.  Whether that is simply because they are unfortunate in being made unemployed, or in living in an area with high unemployment.  Or because their mental capacity is so low that they are unable to gain a job.  There also needs to be a way to cover for those who are unfortunate in that through illness, or injury, they are unable to work.  Without the welfare state we will find ourselves returning to the early victorian times, and before, with massive numbers of people dying through poverty.  As shown by the massive amounts of poverty in africa and South America.  As shown by the increasing numbers of people in poverty within the US.  Without any sort of welfare the US will shortly find that it has the same sort of slums and poverty as South America.  Then maybe the right wing goverment will act.  But I doubt that as it would mean spending their own money, rather than lining their pockets.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-Jul-2010 at 15:22
Perhaps we attempt to agree on what is meant by a welfare state.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Welfare_state

A welfare state is a concept of government where the state plays a key role in the protection and promotion of the economic and social well-being of its citizens. It is based on the principles of equality of opportunity, equitable distribution of wealth, and public responsibility for those unable to avail themselves of the minimal provisions for a good life. The general term may cover a variety of forms of economic and social organization[1]

Second, why wouldn't a democracy be a welfare state?  Perhaps because the majority enjoy abundance and can avoid being aware of the have not's?  The majority is comfortable with the idea they are some how different from needy people so decisions to not care for the less fortunate will not effect them?    What happens if the economy gets worse?   Obama said it is necessary to take steps that will increase the cost of electricity and this is equal to taking a big pay cut.  Paying over $4 per gallon of gas is also equal to taking a big pay cut.   We may be loosing our individual affluence.  

For sure we have to compete for world markets and that means low wages and no benefits.   England began welfare to subsidize industry.   The condition of labors was terrible and industry argued they could not pay more and compete for world markets, so the government picked up the responsibility for welfare.   My very low income friends understand this better than the fat cats.  They know they stand to loose their jobs if their wages are not competitive in the global market.   They are living on the edge and can't afford to miss a pay check.  But affluent people don't seem to comprehend this reality.  Food stamps, housing assistance, and help with medical needs, subsidizes industry, and this is how to have low wages jobs and to be competitive for world markets.   


Edited by Carol - 19-Jul-2010 at 15:41
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opuslola View Drop Down
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  Quote opuslola Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jan-2011 at 18:00
Dear Athena/Carol!

First of all, why do you continually refer to the USA as a Democracy?

Yes, we use that term all of the time, but when it comes to the definition, we are not a Democracy! We are basically a "democratic Republic!", and nothing more!

I don't really believe a real Democracy ever thought of a "tie!", yet our legal system consideres twelve jurors as "democratic", even though there can be a "tie" as the result!

Twelve is a most common number of men(women?) used in the past to divide things into, thus we had "the twelve tribes", the "twelve tribunes", etc., etc., for almost ever and ever!

If a decision has to be made and a tie is the result, and you live in a true demomcracy, then "No action" can be taken! And, just what is the result of a system like that?

Above you wrote;

"For sure we have to compete for world markets and that means low wages and no benefits.   England began welfare to subsidize industry.   The condition of labors was terrible and industry argued they could not pay more and compete for world markets, so the government picked up the responsibility for welfare.   My very low income friends understand this better than the fat cats. They know they stand to loose their jobs if their wages are not competitive in the global market.   They are living on the edge and can't afford to miss a pay check. But affluent people don't seem to comprehend this reality. Food stamps, housing assistance, and help with medical needs, subsidizes industry, and this is how to have low wages jobs and to be competitive for world markets."

If you notice what is happening now, since the Government has decided to take over so much of the previous private sector, that your words above are coming true, that is companies, and even Unions are being left with huge decisions, and they are quickly disolving pensions, medical plans, etc., knowing or fearing future Government controls!

I think it is called "Socialism" or worse?

Just how many "rich" Americans can support the "poor" majority?

It seems what the current administration supports is "equalization!"

"Take from the Rich and give to the Poor!"

Is "Robin Hood" actually in power now?

That is unless you and/or your company are really, really "Green!"

Which means that Al Gore, and GE (General Electric/NBC, etc.) are exempt~!

Regards,

Edited by opuslola - 01-Jan-2011 at 18:05
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  Quote Don Quixote Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-Mar-2012 at 00:14
Welfare is a noble idea that in many cases has negative effect.
I agree that welfare is necessary for people with serious diseases, or conditions that don;t allow them to work; but on the way the lifelong welfare system allows many people who are capable of working and contributing to society to  never feel pressed to find a job, and hence waste their lives in jobless existence - which is a personal tragedy.

People perform best when under duress - and the welfare system removes the fear of starvation, the impulse to survive, and hence becomes a reason for many people to spend their lives in an way that doesn't contribute to their personal progress - instead they are bored, and spend their time doing nothing, sinking in alcoholism, drug addiction, and creating psychological problems for themselves.

Sch welfare systems are not organized well - they basically throw crumbs of people, enabling them yo become users, instead of stimulating them to get education and enable them to live as socially contributing members. I see too many examples of  people living in generational or livelong welfare, women who have children only to get welfare and then neglect them, men who never develop confidence due to lack of social achievements, and sink in one or another form of self-destruction.

I don;t say that the welfare system need to be removed - no, it needs to be rethought. Healthy and capable people have to receive welfare only on short terms, and only after fulfilling requirements of working on social projects or educating themselves successfully, after which they have to try life on heir own back. Lifelong welfare is needed only for disabled or sick people, on healthy ones it's has only negative effect, and destroys their lives, instead of helping them building full and useful existence.
This is my opinion anyway.

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