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Creation of Israel.
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Omar al Hashim View Drop Down
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    Posted: 22-Jan-2009 at 00:35
Originally posted by gcle2003

How can it be a religious state when the large majority of the population don't believe in the religion (or any other, from the polls I've seen)? Israel has religious courts, but they're subject to control by the secular ones: what Arab countries is that true of? (I accept there probably are some.)

Because it was created in order to replicate a religious myth, for a religious group, because 'God gave them the land', and it serves that particular religious group over and above all others.
Originally posted by Cyrus

Al Jassas, I think you know that the main problem in the Middle East is the conflict between Shia and Sunni and Israel is just a pretext, I don't think Sunni Arabs are so gullible to believe Iran is increasing its power in the south of Lebanon and Iraq to fight against Israel!!

Al Jassas is correct. The sunni-shia conflict is encouraged and blown out of all proportion by dictators & invadors that would rather have their population fighting among itself than fighting against them.
Look at the support Hizbullah got with sunnis in the '06 war, and I'd reckon Iran would be more popular than some of the dictators around.
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Posts: 1810 		  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 21:15
Hello Cyrus
 
The main problem in the middle east is there are Arab dictators whose only goal in life is to stay in power no matter what and opress the people, and a regime controlled by power opsessed freaks who use religion to supress their people and drive them into poverty to finance their ridiculous international ambitions. And the worst thing of them all, people who learned never to say NO!
 
 
Israel is a problem of the Palestinians and their neighbours and it can solve itself easily and the deep s**t they are in right now is mostly of their own making.
 
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Posts: 6240 		  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 21:05

Al Jassas, I think you know that the main problem in the Middle East is the conflict between Shia and Sunni and Israel is just a pretext, I don't think Sunni Arabs are so gullible to believe Iran is increasing its power in the south of Lebanon and Iraq to fight against Israel!!
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Posts: 1810 		  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 20:56
Hello gcle
 
All Arab regimes are staunchly secular with civil law as the basic law (based on the French system mostly), even in the "wahhabi" Saudi Arabia.
 
Also, Israel has always been seen in religious terms, it has always been seen as a "Jewish" state not a secular democracy. Judaism is defacto state religion, just look at the exception jews get in Israel.
 
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Posts: 7035 		  Quote gcle2003 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 20:03
Originally posted by Leonidas

Nor is another religious state (Israel) ....
How can it be a religious state when the large majority of the population don't believe in the religion (or any other, from the polls I've seen)? Israel has religious courts, but they're subject to control by the secular ones: what Arab countries is that true of? (I accept there probably are some.)
 
This is essentially an ethnic/tribal/secular issue over land, not a religious one except for a few on either side.
helping anyone else, certainly not Christians which get abused for being on the Arab side of the fence. Syria seems to be the more moderate country and why are they enemy number one and not the Wahhabi monarchy clowns?
Because the Saudis are further away and haven't been as aggressive in the past, and Syria is a neighbour with whom there are territorial disputes. Egypt used to be Israel's enemy number one until the two of them saw some sense. It has nothing much to do with religion, though political leaders on each side of course try and make out it does, so they can get sympathy and aid.

 Christians and Muslism lived in pretty good terms in the Levant before outsiders upset the balance.
And Jews. As they still do pretty well everywhere where they're not squabbling over land.
 The only christians i worry about live in egypt, and those in Iraq (thanks Bush u a*hle) but thats another issue agian.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 20:02
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

Clown this is for "es_bih" to laugh more!!
 
Originally posted by Seko

The topic is called, "Creation of Israel". But if you think, since it's creation, that moslems have gone on massacring christians (especially Armenians) during the time of Israel's creation then prove it.
 
For you 'it' is worse perhaps. But then again you should open another thread about your grudge cause you have your timelines mixed up about this one. And I assume you also care nothing about moslems that were massacred.
I believe the general massacres of non-Mulsims in the Islamic states was a process which could continue into the next century, if a Jewish state was not created in this region.
 
 


What general massacre?. And is it right to replace a fictional massacre with an actual one ?
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Posts: 1810 		  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 14:32
Hello Cyrus
 
Of course Bahais get the royal treatment in Israel, they are similar in their position on Israel as the extremist evangelicals.
 
 The christian/muslim Arab population of Israel doesn't even get half the treatment the Jews in Morocco get. Nearly all of west Jerusalem is built on confiscated church property and literally hundreds of historic mosques, some were in Palestine for over 1350 years were distroyed. To build a mosque in a muslim city in Israel you will be bled to death by paper work and half way into the construction the building will be bulldozed for "lack" of sufficient papers.
 
Finally there is no poof that Bahais ever exceeded tens of thousands let alone five million (20% of the pre-revolution population of Iran). I am with you they are been brutalized and don't deserve anything like this, but sunnis in Iran also suffer as much, where is the condemnation?
 
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Posts: 6240 		  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 13:12

Baha'i world Centre, Haifa, Israel:

It is interesting to read about the situation of Bahais in Iran:
 

They raid the suspected houses of Bahais and just ask you "Are you a Bahai?" and if you answer "Yes" then they will hang you in public immeditaely, with no trial!

There were more than five millions Bahais in Iran but now you can hardly find anyone in Iran or other countries of the region except Israel.
 
What is a General Massacre?


Edited by Cyrus Shahmiri - 21-Jan-2009 at 13:13
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Posts: 6240 		  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 12:32
Clown this is for "es_bih" to laugh more!!
 
Originally posted by Seko

The topic is called, "Creation of Israel". But if you think, since it's creation, that moslems have gone on massacring christians (especially Armenians) during the time of Israel's creation then prove it.
 
For you 'it' is worse perhaps. But then again you should open another thread about your grudge cause you have your timelines mixed up about this one. And I assume you also care nothing about moslems that were massacred.
I believe the general massacres of non-Mulsims in the Islamic states was a process which could continue into the next century, if a Jewish state was not created in this region.
 
 
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Posts: 4613 		  Quote Leonidas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 12:05
the Armenian genocide is more or less a clash of ethno-nationalism in the context of a collapsing empire. The purpose was not religious and it has nothing to do with Israel. Why set a cat amongst the pigeons?

Read my lips, Israel (and the west) fed and nurtured militant Islam. Hamas wouldnt of got past the slums if it wasn't for them. Nor is another religious state (Israel) helping anyone else, certainly not Christians which get abused for being on the Arab side of the fence. Syria seems to be the more moderate country and why are they enemy number one and not the Wahhabi monarchy clowns?

 Christians and Muslism lived in pretty good terms in the Levant before outsiders upset the balance. The only christians i worry about live in egypt, and those in Iraq (thanks Bush u a*hle) but thats another issue agian.


Edited by Leonidas - 21-Jan-2009 at 12:06
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Posts: 1355 		  Quote Beylerbeyi Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 11:23
(And seriously, the Sassanids lost 1300 years ago. Get over it already!)
Ha ha ha, this was a good one.
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Posts: 1810 		  Quote Al Jassas Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21-Jan-2009 at 06:21
Hello Cyrus
 
Those brutal muslims, they ruled poor old Armenia and Georgia for 1100 years and thet say Armenia is one of Al-Qaeda's major recruiting centers while Georgians is the stronghold of wahhabi Islam. One of the reasons why Russia attacked Georgia was to put an end to wahhabi georgian agression on poor Ossetian who belong to the shia sect that they converted to during the 400 years of muslim rule in their lands.
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 23:07
Originally posted by Omar al Hashim




(And seriously, the Sassanids lost 1300 years ago. Get over it already!)



LOLLOLLOLLOL
LOL
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Posts: 5697 		  Quote Omar al Hashim Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 22:37
I'd be happy for as many Jews as want to immigrate to Australia, but not to create a separate homeland in the Kimberly.

The Kimberly is still majority aboriginal, so hundreds of thousands of foriegners flocking into it wouldn't be better for the aboriginies that it is for the Palestinians (worse probably, the Palestinians are more numerous and stronger), not that Aboriginies were even counted in 1948. The eastern states were well and truely stolen from the aboriginies by the 1860s so it is safe to come here - the crime of genocide is on someone else's shoulders.


(And seriously, the Sassanids lost 1300 years ago. Get over it already!)


Edited by Omar al Hashim - 20-Jan-2009 at 22:39
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 19:06
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

The Christian Armenians were masacred, who would be the next poor people?
 


The Muslims at around the same time (Ottoman) were being massacred, too in around the same places by Armenians. So... Yes. Talk about objectivity.


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Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 18:50
The topic is called, "Creation of Israel". But if you think, since it's creation, that moslems have gone on massacring christians (especially Armenians) during the time of Israel's creation then prove it.
 
For you 'it' is worse perhaps. But then again you should open another thread about your grudge cause you have your timelines mixed up about this one. And I assume you also care nothing about moslems that were massacred.
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Posts: 6240 		  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 18:42
Isn't it the first post:
 
Originally posted by pekau

I was just wondering... the establishment of Israel in Middle East clearly did not work out. What if you, as the representive of the victorious Allies, had the power to decide where Israel will be established? Where would you create and and why?
 
And according to your decision, how would it change the world we live in today? Towards better? Towards worse?
Do I have right to say "Towards worse"? Or should we just talk against Israel in this thread?
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Posts: 8595 		  Quote Seko Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 18:34
...and what does your statement have to do with the topic?
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Posts: 6240 		  Quote Cyrus Shahmiri Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 18:31
The Christian Armenians were masacred, who would be the next poor people?
 
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20-Jan-2009 at 18:18
Originally posted by Cyrus Shahmiri

Thanks god that there is a Jewish state in the Middle East, otherwise God knows what would happen in this region under the absolute rule of Muslims! Confused



Embarrassed

You're a riot Clap
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