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Cent
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Topic: Should the Kurds be given independence? Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 07:26 |
What is your suggestion then TheDiplomat? Should Kurds forget thier language in Turkey? Forget that they're Kurds and become Turks?
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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TheDiplomat
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 09:05 |
Please Do not put words in my mouth, Cent!
I never meant to say such .. Kurdish people speak their language freely everywhere...Do not cause misleadings...I personally have Kurdish friends for sure, and I never asked them to change their ethinicity..Noone can accomplish such a thing. Noone is on such a misison, believe me.
My suggestion is that a Kudish state at the expense of Iraq,Syria,Iran and Turkey should not be established in the Middle East...For one state,we should not lead 4 other states and 1 newly established one into constant dislike of each other
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Cent
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 10:20 |
I asked a honest question, I didn't put words in your mouth...
How do YOU want to deal with the Kurdish question in Turkey?
Should they get federalism? Or maybe a state of their own?
What is your opinion?
Just want to honest answers.
Edited by Cent - 15-Feb-2007 at 10:21
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Bulldog
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 12:13 |
Gcle
The suggested Kurdish state is the former Ottoman province of Mosul, whichwas not settled by Turks, not in significant numbers anyway.
Actually it was settled by Turks, infact there are areas of the province where Turkmen's are a majority like parts of Kerkuk, Tel Afar, Tuzhurmatu.
If a Kurdish state is founded in Northern Iraq it won't be very different from Turkey, this time, Kurds will be a majority and Turks a the minority.
In my opinion it doesn't matter if there is a Kurdish state and Turkey, there cannot be a homogeneus Turkish or Kurdish state. For example you can have a Kurdish area next to a Turkish one then another Kurdish then a large Turkish area followed by a smaller Kurdish followed by smaller Turkish followed by larger Kurdish. It's so mixed that whatever you do there will be Kurds in a Turkish state and Turks in a Kurdish state. As I said it's not black and white and comparing it to Ireland as I previously said show's that you don't understand the region because its very different.
If Turkey gives full rights to Kurds and a Kurdish state gives full rights to Turks then it wouldn't matter which state you lived in as both would treat you well.
This would be an ideal situation but will be tough to actually achieve.
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What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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Cent
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 13:44 |
"If a Kurdish state is founded in Northern Iraq it won't be very different from Turkey, this time, Kurds will be a majority and Turks a the minority. "
The difference is mister Bulldog, that minorities have rights in KRG.
Assyrians learn Assyrian, Turkmen learn Turkish and so on. In their schools.
WHY CAN'T KURDS LEARN KURDISH IN TURKEY?!
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Cent
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 13:46 |
http://www.unpo.org/member_profile.php?id=27
Bulldog, that website claim that 13% of Iraq is Turkmen, why even bother get information from that website?
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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TheDiplomat
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 16:57 |
Originally posted by Cent
I asked a honest question, I didn't put words in your mouth...
How do YOU want to deal with the Kurdish question in Turkey?
Should they get federalism? Or maybe a state of their own?
What is your opinion?
Just want to honest answers. |
Cent, actually I do not see a Kurdish Question in Turkey..Because I do not like using the word question while refering to a people... Such use of language do not improve reltions, but increase the gap between the people.
I do not think that there is a need for federalism in sout-eastern part of Turkey...Because this region is not rich, and geographically not a very good place to trade or invest either. Therefore this region would not be able to meet its expenses on its own. So federalism would be shooting their own feet for the people in this region. I have already expressed my opinion very well for their own state, in my opinion.
These are again my honest answers. I really want every people to be happy:)
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Bulldog
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Posted: 15-Feb-2007 at 17:14 |
Cent
The difference is mister Bulldog, that minorities have rights in KRG.
Assyrians learn Assyrian, Turkmen learn Turkish and so on. In their schools.
Don't you realise, you sound exactly like a Turk speaking about Turkey.
Assyrians are complaining about violations made against them by the Kurdish authorities, would you like to see their reports, even Yezidi are. Do they have a point? are they making it up? are they just trying to use the situation? do they just want to present the situation as bad as possible to cause revolt so they can try to get their own state? there are so many scenarios, it depends from which window your looking out from.
Cent
Bulldog, that website claim that 13% of Iraq is Turkmen, why even bother get information from that website?
Unpo is an independant site, a Turkmen or Kurdish site would naturally include bias.
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What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
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Cent
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 04:23 |
Bulldog, so you're honestly believing that there are 3 million Turkmen in Iraq? You're ignorant if so.
"Don't you realise, you sound exactly like a Turk speaking about Turkey."
Do Kurds learn Kurdish in schools? Because Assyrians do learn Assyrian in KRG.
"Assyrians are complaining about violations made against them by the Kurdish authorities, would you like to see their reports"
Please, do not speak about stuff you don't even know of. Those reports are of Christian fundamentalists in the diaspora, they hate Kurdistan and they're jealous of that we are getting our own nation. If you go to KRG you'll see how grateful they are.
They can speak their own language, the are EDUCATED IN ASSYRIAN, and they can do what ever they can. No one is stopping them.
But if you go to Turkey, and one wants to learn Kurdish in schools, it is impossible and you know that.
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Cent
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 04:27 |
Originally posted by TheDiplomat
Originally posted by Cent
I asked a honest question, I didn't put words in your mouth...
How do YOU want to deal with the Kurdish question in Turkey?
Should they get federalism? Or maybe a state of their own?
What is your opinion?
Just want to honest answers. |
Cent, actually I do not see a Kurdish Question in Turkey..Because I do not like using the word question while refering to a people... Such use of language do not improve reltions, but increase the gap between the people.
I do not think that there is a need for federalism in sout-eastern part of Turkey...Because this region is not rich, and geographically not a very good place to trade or invest either. Therefore this region would not be able to meet its expenses on its own. So federalism would be shooting their own feet for the people in this region. I have already expressed my opinion very well for their own state, in my opinion.
These are again my honest answers. I really want every people to be happy:) |
Thank you TheDiplomat.
But if there isn't a Kurdish question, how come over 30 000 people have died in the last 30 years? :S
How come Turkey has several HUNDRED THOUSAND TROOPS IN KURDISTAN?
How come PKK even exists?
How come your Prime Minister has acknowledged the Kurdish question, but you haven't?
There is a Kurdish question, and if you haven't noticed it yet, it is because you've neglected it.
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Cent
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 08:15 |
Feanor said something very good a while ago in another thread concerning the Kurdish question:
"What should be do? We should develop that region both economically and socially. Poverty, unemployment, illiteracy must be just history.
Then we should grant Kurds the rights to preserve their language and culture. The very same thing is valid for other minorities too."
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Zagros
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 08:33 |
Yes, that is the way forward, if Kurds feel respected by Turks as equals then they have no reason to hate, rebel and have wars, it is not in their interest.
Another reason why I dislike PKK is that they threaten any Kurds who co-operate on development with Turkish Government.
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Bulldog
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 11:06 |
Cent
Bulldog, so you're honestly believing that there are 3 million Turkmen in Iraq? You're ignorant if so.
I don't believe anything as there has been no clear cencus for a long time in the region. They could be 3 million they could be 2 or 1 but what is clear is that they have a presence. Numbers are always flying around, some claim that there is 20 million Kurds in the South East and East which is actually impossible as the total population including both regions is little over 12 million. Even if every single person was a Kurd in the region which we know isn't the case it still wouldn't add up.
"Don't you realise, you sound exactly like a Turk speaking about Turkey."
Do Kurds learn Kurdish in schools? Because Assyrians do learn Assyrian in KRG.
As far as I know you can learn Kurdish in Turkey but I think it should be introduced as a language in schools. School's should teach or at least give the option to learn Kurdish also Arabic and Assyrian, all languages spoke in Turkey. It would be far more beneficial than teaching French or German.
Cent
Please, do not speak about stuff you don't even know of. Those reports are of Christian fundamentalists in the diaspora, they hate Kurdistan and they're jealous of that we are getting our own nation. If you go to KRG you'll see how grateful they are.
Well I'm just telling you what some Assyriam groups are reporting, you could be correct so could they, the point is your attitude is not that different to certain Turks you say that you dislike or disagree with.
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What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
Albert Pine
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Batu
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 11:08 |
there are Turkish soldiers in Turkish lands.where is Kurdistan?what is
Kurdistan.it is Turkey's right to destroy separtists,terrorists,killers
isnt it?
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A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari )
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The Hidden Face
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 12:49 |
There is a huge Kurdish question in Turkey and Turkey has offically accepted that.
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Cent
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 13:28 |
Turkey is on the right way (hopefully), and they will (hopefully), let minorities learn their own language and express their own culture.
That is the best way to get rid off separatism.
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Cent
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 13:29 |
"there are Turkish soldiers in Turkish lands.where is Kurdistan?what is Kurdistan.it is Turkey's right to destroy separtists,terrorists,killers isnt it?"
This is the attitude that divides Kurds and Turks....
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They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
Abdul Rahman Qassemlou
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Spartakus
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Posted: 16-Feb-2007 at 13:43 |
Originally posted by Batu
there are Turkish soldiers in Turkish lands.where is Kurdistan?what is
Kurdistan.
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Ehm...we are in a history forum.
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"There are worse crimes than burning books. One of them is not reading them. "
--- Joseph Alexandrovitch Brodsky, 1991, Russian-American poet, b. St. Petersburg and exiled 1972 (1940-1996)
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Batu
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Posted: 24-Feb-2007 at 13:46 |
let them found their own country.But not in my homeland; maybe in
Australia.the Australians must share their continent with an other
nation.
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A wizard is never late,nor he is early he arrives exactly when he means to :) ( Gandalf the White in the Third Age of History Empire Of Istari )
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DayI
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Posted: 24-Feb-2007 at 14:55 |
Originally posted by Spartakus
Originally posted by Batu
there are Turkish soldiers in Turkish lands.where is Kurdistan?what is
Kurdistan.
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Ehm...we are in a history forum.
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then show me in the history if there existed such a country like "kurdistan", lets begin.
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