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Topic ClosedCan Trkiye Enter to northern ıraq??

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Direct Link To This Post Topic: Can Trkiye Enter to northern ıraq??
    Posted: 12-Jan-2007 at 16:42
that's the question
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jan-2007 at 18:35
Didn't they already?
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Jan-2007 at 20:34
If terrorists from Northern Iraq continue to attack Turkey, then it would be fully within Turkey's right to self-defense to retaliate.


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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 09:00
Originally posted by Dan Carkner

Didn't they already?


No. The US is adamantly against it.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 11:28
Can Trkiye Enter to northern ıraq??
And what would be next?
The Kurds are a nation and they are fully aware of that. Violence against them will bring further violence from them.
Turkey should better realize that she can't be oppressing a nation forever. If they want to postpone what seems inevitable, they should grant right to the Kurds so that they won't feel oppressed.
Tukrey entering Iraq will bring only fake military successes like 'we destroyed that camp, we took that mountain, and then pulled back to Turkey'. The Kurds will come back with even more ruthless guerilla fighting. Turkey will have destroyed her relationships with USA. Turkey will probably go to hell thenafter.
 
I'm not kidding. In Greece the civil war in Iraq and the turkish aggression towards the kurds is seen as the best scenario.
    

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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 11:45
It would be folly for Turkey to do such a thing.  I think the Kurdistan authorities should prepare a "Maginot Line" for such an eventuality, modelled on Lebanese Hezbollah. 
 
What's more is that I have not understood the cordial and friendly relations between the Tehran regime and the Kurdistan government, there must be a sub plot to it. 
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 12:29
Its becomming a question of when not if anymore. Iran is gathering intellegence and also will possibly enter, Syria would also like to. It's likely that in the near future due to pressure at home the U.S will be forced to with-draw troops which will leave another power vacuum to the already existing one. Iran like Turkey has established good relations with Barzani, has trade and other relations with him. The motive of this is to know his moves, they know his companies, the way they operate and have made them relient on Turkish goods. When a conflict arises they can shut down his operations and cut the trade and establishments that the North is now relient on.
 
In order to stop the Shia-Sunni confrontations in Baghdad, the U.S is moving two Kurdish regiments into the city. Now its inconcievable to imagine that the American's are completely "stupid", they obviously know what the reprucutions are going to be. The secterian battles will slowly make way for Arab-Kurd battles due to the new presence.
 
Turkey has the right to enter the North and clear out one of the world's most bloodiest Terrorists groups Pkk if they are conducted cross-border terrorist attacks which they have been doing.
 
Iran also has the right to enter as Pkk-Pejak is attacking Iran's soil aswell.
 
 
 


Edited by Bulldog - 13-Jan-2007 at 12:51
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 12:37
"In order to stop the Shia-Sunni confrontations in Baghdad, the U.S is moving two Kurdish regiments into the city."
 
Bulldog, where did you read this? I heard a speech from Barzani, not too long ago, about NOT sending Peshmergas there.
 
"Turkey has the right to enter the North and clear out one of the world's most bloodiest Terrorists groups Pkk if they are conducted cross-border terrorist attacks which they have been doing."
 
Kurds have rights to protect themselves against Turkey. Turkey is in my eyes a ultra-nationalistic state and oppressive against Kurds. So they're not exactly angels, Bulldog.
They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 12:43
Don't call them Peshmerga, they are professional soldiers - Peshmerga makes them sound unofficial. Peshmerga are ideologically motivated guerilla fighters.

Edited by Zagros - 13-Jan-2007 at 12:43
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 12:52
Xristar
And what would be next?
The Kurds are a nation and they are fully aware of that. Violence against them will bring further violence from them. 
 
Them? who is this "them" you speak of, do you think that the average Kurd likes being bullied, having to pay extortions, living in fear and used as cannon fodder by terrorists? Diyarbekir used to be a shining example in the region, it had fantastic prospects, compared to cities like GaziAntep, SanliUrfa, Malatya, Elazig etc it was way in-front. But today it's been ruined, GaziAntep has become a financial centre, Malatya is developing fast, SanliUrfa and Antep are even beginning to establish a tourism industry. Terrorism was rejected in many parts of the South-East and compared to the areas where terrorist bases are in the South East they are now worlds apart. The people in the region don't want to carry on living like this due to the selfish terrorists. The average person cares more about his/her family, providing food on the table, educating the kids then Extremist Marxist Ideological issues.
 
Turkey has made many reforms, the Kurdish generation growing today and the next one's to come will not have any restrictions on their language, culture or identity so your second comment has become "devoid".
 
Turkiye should have given Kurds their full rights from the beginning and she should be condemned for not doing so and accept it was a mistake. However, they cannot keep living in the past, a time must come to move forward,  Kurds must have full cultural rights in addition to their already existing full citizenship rights.
 
 
Xristar
Turkey should better realize that she can't be oppressing a nation forever. If they want to postpone what seems inevitable, they should grant right to the Kurds so that they won't feel oppressed.
Tukrey entering Iraq will bring only fake military successes like 'we destroyed that camp, we took that mountain, and then pulled back to Turkey'.
 
Fake millitary sucess? it's clear you have no understanding of the issue. If wanted, they could eliminate the Pkk presence all its combatants, all related groups, propoganda agencies and financial centres. They could do this in a couple of weeks. That's not the problem, if they had done this in the past, either the Soviets, the Syrians or the Greeks would have just created a new terrorist group. There is a history of such events, for example once Asala terrorism was ended Pkk Terrorism began. When a Terror Org is taken out, the enemies surrounding the state would this time create an even more sickly monster.
 
However, today the Soviets are no more, Syria has changed its agenda, Greece doesn't want to be caught sponsering Terrorism.
 
Pkk Terrorism is today kept alive to suit U.S and Israeli interests, what they would like is for the Org to change its agenda and focus of Iran and Syria. But with so much on U.S plate this avenue is not looking as good anymore. With the situation on Turkey's borders becomming such that the only credible threat is now focued on North Iraq a situation is arrising where it could be possible and time to eliminate the group and uproot it.
 
 
Xristar
The Kurds will come back with even more ruthless guerilla fighting. Turkey will have destroyed her relationships with USA. Turkey will probably go to hell thenafter.
 
Kurds didn't begin any of these Terrorist Organisations. Pkk is an extremist Marxist Org, originally created in the Bekaa valley by Soviet-Syrian intellegence in addition to a whole host of other frankenstein Terrorist groups created in that valley. Soviets wanted a Communist revolution, they failed and so created DHKP/C and PKK Terror. Syria's interests were the "Hatay" region.
 
If there is a millitary intervention I don't think there will be any sudden retreat. Plus if you listen to the new voices comming out of Washington, the U.S is starting to change its views on a Turkish intervention, if it pulls out it may actually want one.
 
Don't be suprised by anything in Iraq, anything could happen and should be expected it could swing anyway.
 
 
 
Cent
"In order to stop the Shia-Sunni confrontations in Baghdad, the U.S is moving two Kurdish regiments into the city."
 
Bulldog, where did you read this? I heard a speech from Barzani, not too long ago, about NOT sending Peshmergas there.
 
Do you think America is going to put its new 20,000 troops in alone? two Kurdish regiments are being sent in on the front lines.
 
 
 
Cent 
Kurds have rights to protect themselves against Turkey. Turkey is in my eyes a ultra-nationalistic state and oppressive against Kurds. So they're not exactly angels, Bulldog.
 
And from the Turks perception's, Pkk Terrorist Org is one of the most bloodiest in the world and they are conducting attacks in Turkey from bases in Northern Iraq. The Kurdish regime can tackle this problem or Turkey can both have the right to in the global war against Terror.


Edited by Bulldog - 13-Jan-2007 at 12:57
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 13:00
"Do you think America is going to put its new 20,000 troops in alone? two Kurdish regiments are being sent in on the front lines."
 
Has it been acknowledged by the Kurdish authorities? As I said, last I heard, Barzani was against such an action.
They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 14:04
I read that news too.(from a turkish newspaper)
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Jan-2007 at 21:29
You probably can guess my answer to the topic of this thread. The question is not whether Turkey can enter, it is should they enter. And the answer depends on who you are and where you come from. So personally, I'm not going to say anything about it because I'm far removed from the area and I'm also biased based on my nationality.

From a technocratic perspective this depends on whether Iraq will manage to remain as one nation or will break apart to zones of influence; in the latter case everyone in the area will move in to grab a piece, Sunnis, Shias (Iran?), Turkey, Syria, Jordan(?). It also depends on whether the US (the biggest guarantee that iraq will remain whole) will manage to maintain its military presence in the area. If the US left today, Iraq will be devoured amongst the interested parties practically overnight.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jan-2007 at 07:13
Technically evet,but with the US above it's bas,hayir.Wink
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jan-2007 at 07:33
Originally posted by Spartakus

Technically evet,but with the US above it's bas,hayir.Wink

Big%20smile





The Turkish-Kurdish well accualy Turkish-PKK conflict is a verry delicate issue

the US isn't helping accualy there putting more oil on the fire.



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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jan-2007 at 09:07
"Don't call them Peshmerga, they are professional soldiers - Peshmerga makes them sound unofficial. Peshmerga are ideologically motivated guerilla fighters."
 
But they are Peshmergas!
They don't speak enough about the Kurds, because we have never taken hostages, never hijacked a plane. But I am proud of this.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jan-2007 at 17:06
Originally posted by Bulldog

Pkk is an extremist Marxist Org
 
No, PKK left Marxism-Leninism in the first half of the 90s.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14-Jan-2007 at 18:05
Originally posted by Cent

"Do you think America is going to put its new 20,000 troops in alone? two Kurdish regiments are being sent in on the front lines."
Originally posted by Mortaza

I read that news too.(from a turkish newspaper)
CNN mentioned that it was one Brigade.  This makes sense because the Kurds and friendly Iraqis are orgainized to the U.S. system. The Brigade is now the standard manuver unit of U.S. forces.
 
The  references to two Kurdish "regiments" probably indicates that the Kurdish Brigade has two batalions.  In the U.S. system, Batalions are large and carry regimental battle colors / lineages.  
 
So... what the Turkish newspaper and CNN are probably stating is that  One Kurdish Brigade consisting of two Batalions is being sent to Baghdad.  This would mean about 2,500 soldiers.  


Edited by Cryptic - 14-Jan-2007 at 18:09
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jan-2007 at 03:03
I read 3,000 in the SF Chronicle today. General consensus according to the newspaper is tha the Kurds themselves are sceptical because it will seem that they interfere in what has so far remained a Sunni-Shia conflict.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jan-2007 at 07:20
I can't believe they would accept such a suicidal position as the one they'll be entering, currently the Kurds have had the least of the trouble why get involved now? it's a game and there being used I hope they wake up, throwing in another minority to confront another ethnic group divided secterianly could infact create an ethnic conflict, Arab-Kurd in Baghdad and quell the Shia-Sunni fighting.
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