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The Dravidian Problem

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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: The Dravidian Problem
    Posted: 10-Sep-2007 at 02:38

I have read the posting completely.

 

I find the members have purposely diverted the issue instead of tackling the issue.

 

We Dravidians oppose the interpretation of K. V. Ramakrishna Rao. I doubt that he might be an Aryan and therefore, we understand that he interprets Tamil literature in that way. Do think that I am bringing racial factor, when people identify themselves and others, we have to follow the same.

 

There have been thousands of books written by many reputed historians explaining the difference between Aryans and Dravidians. Dravidians have unique culture. Non can claim over such Dravidian culture.

 

I find the points raised by sunswing1983 have not been answered.

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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Sep-2007 at 04:30

 

Coming to my paper The Dravidian Problem, it has also been disturbed:

 

When I found, I requested and then, perhaps Nothman made it appear.

 

edit:  tried to correct the format of this post - it's a bit better, but far from perfect.



Edited by Northman -
02-Mar-2007 at 22:19

But, evidently, as some points were missing, I think I have made the following posting with request:

 

I am very sorry that my postings are definitely disturbed and the reason I do not know.

 

Here, is another example.

 

When a researcher spend time, energy and money to bring out paper and post for intellectual discussion and debate for furthering reseearch, but, here, unfortunately, I find this type of things happen.

 

So, I request the owners / incharge / moderators to look into this and do the needful to set right the postings.

 

Mr. Northman, 

But, how it happened?

Anyway, it is interesting to see my paper again as, if resurrected.

I shall either edit it again as suggested or add, as new problem of "limitation" has come, as has been implied Omar.

 

Any way, the Aryan-Dravidian discussion prompted me to see my earlier postings.

 

If the discussion is started, we can discuss and debate here itself.

History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote M. Nachiappan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Jul-2007 at 05:01

But, kindly note who has suggestred?

I am only trying out the historical possibility.

Mentioning the people of Bharat / ancient India as Tamils, etc., creates problem or makes one misunderstand and even misinterpret.

Indians had power in those days. So we have to read "Indians", when "Tamils" are mentioned.
 
Anyway, I do not want to divert from the subject matter.
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  Quote Dharmendra Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 08-Jul-2007 at 13:21
Pathani is saying Bs^ The fact is this is just a lie to say tamils were ruling entire india. Tamils never had such power. I dont know why Tamils are being glorified on this site.
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  Quote M. Nachiappan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jul-2007 at 04:31

We talk about the events of whatever nature happened 2500-3000 YBP or more.

What Pathani has mentioned about people of Kashmir and Tamizhagam could have been slip of tongue or he wanted to say some other thing, we do not know.

If we go by the hypothesis that Tamils were ruling entire India and even beyond north-west and north-east, the Tamil-protagonists would be more happy to consider.

Interestingly, important maritime / naval technology words have closeness to the words in Tamil and as well as Sanskrit. Of corse, both have many similarities.

Scientifically, one cannot be sure to what extent people could be exactly identified with any factor - chromosome etc.

Ironically, at one side, we go on ague all human beings are one, Universal brotherhood (anybody talks about Universal Sisterhood) and so on. Why then divide people like this?

The movement of people from the south to north in India and thereafter has not been studied properly. I think, here scholars have to concentrate. the Tsunami-studies might reveal more about such exigencies.

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  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04-Jul-2007 at 00:57

"Geographical and climatic factors affect morphological elements."

 

This is world wide accepted one by the researchers and scientists, where these two factors have complete impact over color ness of people. But here it takes centuries together for a sub-group to get morphed and turn different from its parental group. It's not instant!

 

Annnd Kashmir and Nepali are much different groups from rest of the groups of this subcontinent. Why comparing tamil with kashmiri, compare Punjabi or bihari with kashimiri.You will find the same lot of differences.

 

Sameway, Punjabis cannot be excluded and what can be said for the browner, darker, shorter Punjabis (sub groups) among.

 

Rapes and concubine takings by omkara are third level grounds taken for explanation.

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  Quote M. Nachiappan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03-Jul-2007 at 05:35
Perhaps, he is trying to refer to the attempts made by Tamil kings who marched to Himalayas and planted their royal insignia there as a mark of their victory.
 
Then, naturally, they must have crossed Kashmir.
 
The Kashmir kumkum has been very famous and auspicious to Tamil women.
 
So also, the Kasmiri Saiva religion.
 
The Tamil Princess from Madurai was married to Shiva of Himalayas.
 
Even Adi Sankara, in his so journ visited Kashmir.
 
Most of the Saiva manuscripts could be obtained from Kashmir.
 
Of course, now the situation is different because of Islamic fundamentalism and terrorism.
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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jul-2007 at 20:56
You have made this statement in "Kashmiri Genetics"Kashmir was ruled by Tamils for a long time. i would say 80% of the kashmiri genes are Tamils.
How then then tests mentioned and discussed would correlate your findings?
 
Would the other experts, who actually get their samples tested accept your conclusion / idea.
 
Incidentally, in another posting, you raised a point to that effect as to whether Tamils were there in IVC. The genetic tests could be conducted to prove the fact.
History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jul-2007 at 08:34

You say all appear morphologically alike after miscegenation?

Or you change your stand as posted earlier?

History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote pathani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jul-2007 at 01:37
i mean they are very different in physical features, looks wise.
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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01-Jul-2007 at 01:27
I take your two sentences:
 
1. The difference between lets say a person of kashmir and then a person from tamil nadu could not be more different.
That means there is no difference between people of Kashmir and Tamilnadu. Wonderful, then.
 
2. Thier physical features are totally different.
What is this?
History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote pathani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30-Jun-2007 at 22:32
^ no man your wrong. The difference between lets say a person of kashmir and then a person from tamil nadu could not be more different. Thier physical features are totally different.
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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24-Jun-2007 at 11:52

I have noted the endogamous and exogamous claims of certain clans / groups.

Geographical and climatic factors affect morphological elements, which cannot be taken as finality of deciding anything.

Change in such factors along with miscegenation could bring more changes during the course.

Ayway purity of any factor claimed in such exclusive manner would lead to complication only.

History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jun-2007 at 23:32

Not really, excluding the Punjab and Kashmir regions most of India is homogenous with some exceptions. Punjab, Haryana, Himachal Pradesh are the states which were bordering states thus being affected by inter-breeding. We have proof of Greek genes being found amongst 50% of the Khatris (business caste) in Punjab region as well as 30% of Jaats, Gujjars etc.  These are the mixed breeds of India/Pakistan who were products of rapes and concubine takings.

The true warriors (Rajpoots) and pure blooded men of the Indian soil never took women of other lands regardless.
 
 
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  Quote pathani Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23-Jun-2007 at 22:56

i am not sure if aryans existed in india or not. but one thing is for sure today north india has a lot of foriegn blood. ( for example punjabis look so different from tamils)

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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16-Jun-2007 at 07:06

The political "Aryans-Dravidians" may not die down, whether they are black, brown or white.

 
Even though, Ambedkar too rejected the Aryan-Dravidian hypotheses and theories, they are propagated, because of the politics involved and not reality or scientific principles involved.
 
I mentioned Asko Parpola, because, the Dravidian protagonists of Tamilnadu do not accept his hypotheses and theories.
 
The western scholars, when they come to Tamilnadu, they talk one thing at one place and some other thing in some other place. But, when they write from ther places, they write differently.
History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Jun-2007 at 00:30
Originally posted by K. V. Ramakrishna Rao

 
Both Rama and Krishna are Indian popular deities with "dark colur - black / blue", but ironically considered as "Aryan".
 
 
 
As of today, the sub-continent people are identified and received as 'BROWNS' by westerners as well as by rest of the world (why dark?)


Edited by pumaaa123 - 11-Jun-2007 at 01:13
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  Quote K. V. Ramakrishna Rao Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Jun-2007 at 08:23
Sorry friends for the gap.
 
I am just returning after attending an all Indian seminar on Ramayana.
 
The connection of Ramayana with Egypt and other African countries has been interesting and it again explodes the myth of "Aryan-Dravidian" completely.
 
Both Rama and Krishna are Indian popular deities with "dark colur - black / blue", but ironically considered as "Aryan".
 
Perplexed by it, even Asko Parpolar confessed in Madras that they were "aryan" and the entire "fight" was among themselves only i.e, "Aryan". See, the westerners, being the whites always want "Aryan", though, historically, there are none.
 
I think, we better concentrate in issues which help us more than these discarded "racial myths".
History is not what was written or is written, but it is actually what had happened in the past.
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  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jun-2007 at 06:25
Sunsing  \/
 
Genetic and Nasal Index???

 

Irrespective of being white Caucasians you can differentiate a Polish with a German and a Russian with an English on above basis. The same applies for the People of Indian subcontient. Moreover, "A civilization that prolonged for much longer period will naturally produce diversified outputs"



Edited by pumaaa123 - 07-Jun-2007 at 06:26
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  Quote pumaaa123 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 07-Jun-2007 at 06:09

Sunsung, yours is fun and baseless!

 

Yours lingusitic similarities is biggest joke. When most of south-asian languages (like bangla, kannada etc) are so young being less than 1000 years old (other than of sanskrit and tamil) how come you insist that. Even hindi, tamil and other few indian languages follow same format and script. You can check for the sameness with these below vowels/constants of hindi with tamil, ha, haa, maa, pa, ta, la, ka, cha, knya, na, tha, nah, yaa, ra etc. The vowel series followed in tamil and hindi is very same. To the most the pronounsation of vowels are alike in both languages. People of Indian-subcontinent have one root be it lingual or ethnic.

 

So what do you say for the cities in same names 'Salem' in south india, america and europe. So are you ready to insist a connection in this basis. 

 

Zoological, Botanical, Reptiles, Mammals, Botanical etc are becuase most of today continents were one land which later splitted and moved to become different continents. Yours 'zoo and Botanical' base fit to discussed for that era. ...Millions of year back. lumeria, kumari which were swept by sunamis could clear you to the best.

 

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