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Iran, get nukes fast!

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LeonardoTurco View Drop Down
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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Iran, get nukes fast!
    Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 04:23
I find it very concerning the USA might attack a non-nuclear power using nuclear weapons. This would give current non-nuclear powers  a fair reason to actually develop an atomic arsenal, so as to be safe of US attacks.

I see any atomic power as a threat to world peace. It's an alarming trend to see atomic weapons be banalised.
APRIL 23 National Sovereignty & Children's day: peace at home, peace in the world.


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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 06:15
[QUOTE=SearchAndDestroy]

I don't think the US public got suckered into anything. The People who leaned toward the left were against, alot of the right thought it was a bad idea, and half of Americans didn't know where Iraq.

In other words the citizen has no say in the USA? When the citizens of Turkey protested the possible gesture toward USA to let USA attack Irak from it soil, they gave up the idea. If you were against the war, did you protest? Why did it not change anything? Your president was elected by a minority of US citizens yet he has the power to decide for the world. Turkey is your ally yet your army has betrayed us in Irak. You killed innocent people in Irak, treat Irakees like subhumans, you provoked civil war, in fact you are yourself the demon you try to portray others. Saddam is a tyran but you supported him in the first place and now civilians have to go trough sufference because of your aggressive foreing policy.
Perhaps some Americans think good for them because they like tiny puppet regimes don't they. Are you still proud to be part of such a country?

I hope this won't happen. Seems like Bush is on a rampage. We put Clinton up for impeachment, but we don't Bush when he just keeps picking and choosing what to blow up even though most Americans disagree with what he does already. You'd think with the polls and all the protests there are he'd get an idea that people don't want him to continue on with his personal campaign...


You may not have thought about it before, you don't have to continue suffering and pay taxes in a country that supports silly wars.
I invite you to relieve yourself from further embarassment and to  take your family with you and exile to one country that stands by good principles: Turkey. The beautifull country rich in culture with sweet people. Give your kids their chance to grow up to become honnorable and lucky able to call themselves Turks! What Americans and Turks have in common is that they're not xenophobe and are a people with hope who want to build a better future so you'll feel at home unlike in some other destinations. Wherever you are, 

"Come, come again, whoever you are, come!

Heathen, fire worshipper or idolatrous, come!
Come even if you broke your penitence a hundred times,
Ours is the portal of hope, come as you are."
-the Great Anatolian philosopher Mevlana Celaleddin Rumi

Edit: removed red colour for your eyes' pleasure.


Edited by LeonardoTurco
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  Quote Akolouthos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 06:38

Originally posted by Leonardo Turco

In other words the citizen has no say in the USA? When the citizens of Turkey protested the possible gesture toward USA to let USA attack Irak from it soil, they gave up the idea. If you were against the war, did you protest? Why did it not change anything? Your president was elected by a minority of US citizens yet he has the power to decide for the world. Turkey is your ally yet your army has betrayed us in Irak. You killed innocent people in Irak, treat Irakees like subhumans, you provoked civil war, in fact you are yourself the demon you try to portray others. Saddam is a tyran but you supported him in the first place and now civilians have to go trough sufference because of your aggressive foreing policy.
Perhaps some Americans think good for them because they like tiny puppet regimes don't they. Are you still proud to be part of such a country?

You may not have thought about it before, you don't have to continue suffering and pay taxes in a country that supports silly wars.
I invite you to relieve yourself from further embarassment and to  take your family with you and exile to one country that stands by good principles: Turkey.
The beautifull country rich in culture with sweet people. Give your kids their chance to grow up to become honnorable and lucky able to call themselves Turks! What Americans and Turks have in common is that they're not xenophobe and are a people with hope who want to build a better future so you'll feel at home unlike in some other destinations. Welcome! 

Aye, Turkey protested the U.S. action in Iraq. And after they voted not to support the U.S. effort, they sent troops into the north anyhow. It was a bit hypocritically imperialistic, don't ya think, maybe even..."aggressive"?

By the way, Bush was elected by a majority of U.S. citizens in 2004. As for the 2000 election (man we're going to be talking about that till we're old, aren't we ), we have an electoral system.

As for us "betraying" you, our "allies", I say again: TURKEY refused to support the effort, and then TURKEY sent troops into the north, against the request of the President and the coalition.

As for treating people like subhumans...: Greeks, Armenians, Cypriots and, most relevant to the discussion, KURDS. And yes, I am proud to be an American citizen.

As for your "invitation" to "one country that stands by 'good principles'" I think I shall decline. Ethnic minorities don't have the best history in Turkey, do they? As for good principles: Greeks, Armenians, Cypriots, and Kurds.

And as for "What Americans and Turks have in common is that they're not xenophobe".... Both America and Turkey demonstrate xenophobia in their own special ways. The difference is that recently we have stopped killing people because of our xenophobic tendencies.

-Akolouthos



Edited by Akolouthos
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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 08:08
[QUOTE=Akolouthos]



Aye, Turkey protested the U.S. action in Iraq. And after they voted not to support the U.S. effort, they sent troops into the north anyhow. It was a bit hypocritically imperialistic, don't ya think, maybe even..."aggressive"?

You live confortably far from Irak, but we have to endure the consequences, you're not really in the position to frown upon our will to protect our land.
And Turkey is not imperialistical. We long ago gave up imperialistic ambitions. Even Hitler realised he couldn't get us on his side because he knew he couldn't promise us anyone else's land because Turks wouldn't accept that.
We just want to live in peace. You have no right to come in this part of the world to impose your will. This is clearly imperialistic.

 


By the way, Bush was elected by a majority of U.S. citizens in 2004. As for the 2000 election (man we're going to be talking about that till we're old, aren't we ), we have an electoral system.


As for us "betraying" you, our "allies", I say again: TURKEY refused to support the effort, and then TURKEY sent troops into the north, against the request of the President and the coalition.

As for treating people like subhumans...: Greeks, Armenians, Cypriots and, most relevant to the discussion, KURDS. And yes, I am proud to be an American citizen.


You've been grown up to hate on Turks and that is really a pity because we could live in peace if you let go prejudices. We don't grow up with prejudice against other people unlike you.
btw if you're supportive of PKK who kill innocent Turkish citizens including ethnic Kurds that is really really a pity.





As for your "invitation" to "one country that stands by 'good principles'" I think I shall decline. Ethnic minorities don't have the best history in Turkey, do they? As for good principles: Greeks, Armenians, Cypriots, and Kurds.

And as for "What Americans and Turks have in common is that they're not xenophobe".... Both America and Turkey demonstrate xenophobia in their own special ways. The difference is that recently we have stopped killing people because of our xenophobic tendencies.

-Akolouthos

I was thinking about xenophobia against new immigrants. You can be of any background yet you'll be accepted as an American.
Turks don't hate on other people, last time I went to Turkey, I got asked about Belgian culture and music by a curious shop keeper. As a child my father made cards on which he'd write facts on all the different countries and their culture. Unlike you who prefer to hate, Turks grow up to like the one who's different.

Your country thinks of 'world domination', we think of the countries all over the world as the organs of a body for which you should care as if your own body if one should be sick. Of course you don't know how civilised and ethical we are because you still thinking in Medieval way that Turks are barbars!


Edit: removed red colour.



Edited by LeonardoTurco
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  Quote Akolouthos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 09:03

You are correct. We in America have been raised to hate Turks and the Turkish people. The first day of kindergarten they show us the propaganda video How to Properly Hate Turks. The indoctrination doesn't stop there. Throughout our primary schooling we are exposed to a program entitled Basics of Turk Hating. It continues into high-school (my extra-curricular activities were football--our mascot was the Anti-Turk--and intramural Hating of Turks--although this was only available in the spring. Nor is high school the end of the American Anti-Turkish conspiracy. In college we are exposed to a wide array of courses in which we specialize in different forms of Anti-Turk learning. My favorite courses were "Gender Studies in Modern Anti-Turkism" and "Afrocentric Anti-Turkism."

But now that you have exposed the American anti-Turk conspiracy, we can all hope that this horrible system will fall apart. I'm very glad to find that you are "interested" in other cultures... as long as they are not occupying lands that you feel you have a strategic right to. Please pardon my barbarous western medieval perspective.

I think I shall avoid getting drawn into a discussion dominated by nationalistic propaganda. Feel free to continue without me; may you have much joy of it.

-Akolouthos

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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 09:51
[QUOTE=Akolouthos]

You are correct. We in America have been raised to hate Turks and the Turkish people. The first day of kindergarten they show us the propaganda video How to Properly Hate Turks. The indoctrination doesn't stop there. Throughout our primary schooling we are exposed to a program entitled Basics of Turk Hating. It continues into high-school (my extra-curricular activities were football--our mascot was the Anti-Turk--and intramural Hating of Turks--although this was only available in the spring. Nor is high school the end of the American Anti-Turkish conspiracy. In college we are exposed to a wide array of courses in which we specialize in different forms of Anti-Turk learning. My favorite courses were "Gender Studies in Modern Anti-Turkism" and "Afrocentric Anti-Turkism."

But now that you have exposed the American anti-Turk conspiracy, we can all hope that this horrible system will fall apart. I'm very glad to find that you are "interested" in other cultures... as long as they are not occupying lands that you feel you have a strategic right to. Please pardon my barbarous western medieval perspective.

I think I shall avoid getting drawn into a discussion dominated by nationalistic propaganda. Feel free to continue without me; may you have much joy of it.

-Akolouthos

Hopefully you'll visit Turkey one day or make some good Turkish friends and change your mind.
Also, I never said you're 'barbars'. You're 'yabancı' for me, that's 'foreigner'.

Edit: Turkish hatred is very present in your post.  I wonder where the prejudice came from if you haven't been fed them? Example is the highlighted part of your post. And even if you don't care to reply, it's there for everyone to see

Edit II: removed red colour for your eyes' pleasure.



Edited by LeonardoTurco
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 11:55

 

    What is present in his post is sarcasm, and with good reason.  Ultra-nationalist BS is usually reacted to in that way when one wants to remain polite but not totally ignore the issue.

     By the By-   since you seem to be head cheerleader for the Turkey is wonderful club, whyzit you live in Belgium?



Edited by red clay
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  Quote Iranian41ife Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 12:25

omg! bush is officially crazy! i just heard on the news that he was quoted as saying that he will be the only president now and in the future to ever have the courage to "save" iran.

mr. bush, you think you can save iran by nuking it? there is something big going on right now, we just have to wait and see what it is, but now im mroe convinced that htis bush administration has huge plans in mind, and WWIII could be closer than we imagine.

"If they attack Iran, of course I will fight. But I will be fighting to defend Iran... my land. I will not be fighting for the government and the nuclear cause." ~ Hamid, veteran of the Iran Iraq War
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  Quote SearchAndDestroy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 13:02

In other words the citizen has no say in the USA? When the citizens of Turkey protested the possible gesture toward USA to let USA attack Irak from it soil, they gave up the idea. If you were against the war, did you protest? Why did it not change anything? Your president was elected by a minority of US citizens yet he has the power to decide for the world.
Bush only listens to those who he wants to. He drives by protesters like they aren't there, refuses to answer questions by them, and if any of the people that are in his tight circle disagrees with him he lets them go. He only wants people to support him.

Turkey is your ally yet your army has betrayed us in Irak
I think the US hurt alot of friendships with allies. Yet some still came even though they disagreed with it. So there is nothing special there.

You killed innocent people in Irak, treat Irakees like subhumans, you provoked civil war, in fact you are yourself the demon you try to portray others. Saddam is a tyran but you supported him in the first place and now civilians have to go trough sufference because of your aggressive foreing policy.
You? As in me? I didn't do anything. I don't support this war, and my state had the popular vote against Bush both times, along with the rest of New England. Though I think New Hampshire went red at one of the elections.

Perhaps some Americans think good for them because they like tiny puppet regimes don't they. Are you still proud to be part of such a country?
All Americans are proud of our country, just not the current adminstration. Seems like Americans are different from Turkey if your going to ask that question. All of us Americans have different ideas on how the country should work. We all are very individualistic. We usually disagree with each other and in bad times we band together. Even today the North and South have alittle animosity towards each other(more so the south).

See I really don't agree with Bush and his Iraq War, while Akolouthos agrees with Bush, though I don't know if he really supports the war. Yet both of us are very proud to be Americans even though we have different ideas.

You may not have thought about it before, you don't have to continue suffering and pay taxes in a country that supports silly wars.
I'm not suffering, and by not paying taxes means I lose everything I have. And if you say, "Then why not just move out of the country", then that means I can never help turn things around here. I don't give up that easily and call it quits, that'd be just un-American. 

I invite you to relieve yourself from further embarassment and to  take your family with you and exile to one country that stands by good principles: Turkey.
That would be a Embarrassment. It means I'd put my tail between my legs and run away(I don't have a tail, just a saying). Our forefathers fought in the Revolution against one of the Greatest Powers of the times, and they won for fighting in what they believed in. I'm not going to start a war aginst my own country, unless Bush decides not to leave office in 2008.  But I'm also not going to agree with the current adminstration, and I hope to see change in the government one day.

 Give your kids their chance to grow up to become honnorable and lucky able to call themselves Turks!
I'd rather they be called Americans. My kids will grow up to be honorable New Englanders. They will vote for whats right and maybe help make good changes in this country one day. And if they vote for politics I don't agree with, I'll send them to Turkey.

"A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government." E.Abbey
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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 13:34
Whatever. Rhetoric is just parole. You're trying to turn me into some kind of person that I'm not.  His posts are full of gratious and depressing anti-Turkish sentiments.

I understand that you can only accept a Turk when he goes down his knees and kiss your feet.

What you fail to understand is that Turks are well intentioned and honest people. We stand by strong principles and have always earned our honnour. If you can accept that it'll show your good intentions. If you continue your anti-Turkish rhetoric then you clearly do not want piece in the world. 

BTW. let's shift the discussion again to your country's will to attack yet another country. Let's shift this discussion to the possibility of your country to use nuclear weapons against a non-nuclear power. Let's shift this discussion to all the facts that should make you, PROUD AMERİCANS, talk a tone lower, especially if that is toward a Turk.

These days I started reading a book about the old city of Athenes with its Acropole . I have Greek friends, my grandmother learned to speak some Armenian because she lived in piece with Armenians in Turkey. I have many ethnic Kurd friends in Turkey. I'm in piece with all the so-called ethnic groups Turks hate on.
The world does not need your anti-Turkish rhetorics, and I felt deeply insulted with Akolouthos' racist remarks.
How many books about Turkey did you read?? Do you have Turkish friends?

I'm an easy target but who cares about me? I don't represent Turkey! I just want to express my opinion which you try to ignore.

Edit: removed red colour for your eyes' pleasure.








Edited by LeonardoTurco
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  Quote Akolouthos Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 14:11

I am all for getting back to the topic at hand, which we were discussing until someone brought Turkey into all of this.

By the way, excuse me, but I will not stand idly by while you charge me with being a racist. If you can't brook rational disagreement then I'm afraid you are in the wrong forum.

-Akolouthos

P.S.

Originally posted by SearchAndDestroy

See I really don't agree with Bush and his Iraq War, while Akolouthos agrees with Bush, though I don't know if he really supports the war. Yet both of us are very proud to be Americans even though we have different ideas.

Bingo!



Edited by Akolouthos
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  Quote red clay Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 14:14

 

Leonardo-

 

      Oh give it a rest!   You are- either trying to start a flame war, which won't happen, or, you might be one of our "famous AE ghosts" simply looking to disrupt a decent thread. Either way someones going to hit the button on you, if it hasn't happened already. 



Edited by red clay
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  Quote cattus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 18:01
Speaking of buttons.. Leonardo, use the quote button or use the [quote][/quote] code. And please kill the colors, its hard to read!


"Afrocentric Anti-Turkism"?.. never missed a class.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 18:31
Originally posted by pikeshot1600


Well, Dharmagape does list one of his interests as "conspiracy theories."

The bulk of people who ridicule, mock and deride so-called "conspiracy theories" along with people who treat them seriously examining them are in reality ignoramuses. They deny something a priori, in advance because it is too scary and/or too frightening and/or too impossible and/or too weird and it does not fit their dogmats, doctrines and believies, usually quite restricted ones. Such people are narrow-minded. They usually tend to explain uncomfortable for them facts as coincidences or find some "rational" explanations for them or just deny them outright, in advance not even looking at them. They are vulnerable to different kinds of manipulations and they even don't realize it. What is more, they perceive themselves as wiser, more intelligent, more rational in contary to "those ridiculous conspiracionists". It is both ridiculous and sad.  Very often they are blind because they want to be blind, because it's easier and more comfortable to be blind and not to notice facts and evidence which could undermine their outlook. Such attitude and behaviour are:
1.primitive;
2.very harmful both for them and for the whole society.
Moreover, such ignorance is very often used by special services (CIA, KGB, etc.) to cover black operations, to carry out psychological warfare, to spread propaganda, to convince society to their agendas and plans, ex.:
- state X is bad and we must attack it;
- person X is dictator and we must overthrow him in order to "liberate" the oppresed nation, etc (sometimes it's true that person X or state X are bad but the real purposes, aims and reasons for assault or coup d'etat remain  hidden before the eyes of society).
So-called "conspiracy theories" should never be disregarded, neglected, rejected and sneered at in advance. The one who does it is simply an ignoramus.

Historia est magistra vitae (history is the teacher of life). One of the things that history teaches us is to be humble towards our knowledge and be cautious and skeptical but not blind. In the past often new avant-garde hypothesis and theories were rejested and their followers were ridiculed, mocked or even persecuted ex. Nicolaus Copernicus, Galileo Galilei,  Alfred Wegener and many others. We have also historical examples of "conspiracy theories" which at first were ridiculed and rejected by the most of the society but later turned out to be true. Holocaust was also once "a stupid conspiracy theory" (in Germany during WW II and to some extent in the West as well) but it turned out to be true, even although that truth was tremendously horrifying. Other examples: the fire of Reichstag and ancient Rome, FDR knowing about the upcoming attack on Pearl Harbor and not reacting, Katy, the Great Famine in the Ukraine, etc.

Here in Poland we have a saying: "In every legend is a grain of truth" (I suppose that such or similar sayings are common in other Christian nations as well). I consider this saying as wise. In my opinion in almost every legend, myth, "conspiracy theory", sometimes even in gossip is something true. Moreover, I strongly believe that they are legends and "conspiracy theories" in which there is much more than just a grain of truth.

As regards American establishment and its links to Nazi it is a well known fact ex.: operation paperclip, IBM, the American support of Nazi-like dictators in Latin America (Augusto Pinochet Ugarte, Jorge Videla and others), etc.

I'm not going to send more posts on this topic. I simply don't have  enough time (and I won't have it at leats in the nearest future). I've just shortly presented my opinion.


Edited by Dharmagape
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  Quote pikeshot1600 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09-Apr-2006 at 20:32

Thanks for calling me an ignoramus, as I needed that today.

And no, conspiracy theories do not fit my "dogmats" nor my "believies."

Too bad you will not post anymore, as we all would like to know about how Americans were so pro-Nazi that we fought the Second World War to defeat them.



Edited by pikeshot1600
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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Apr-2006 at 04:58
[QUOTE=SearchAndDestroy]

Bush only listens to those who he wants to. He drives by protesters like they aren't there, refuses to answer questions by them, and if any of the people that are in his tight circle disagrees with him he lets them go. He only wants people to support him.

--
I think the US hurt alot of friendships with allies. Yet some still came even though they disagreed with it. So there is nothing special there.


While the citizens of European countries were generally against a war, like the Turkish citizens, I think here Turkey showed to be the only real democracy because their government listened their voice while being a decision against our historical partner, who promised us big economic compensation. But Turks have the right to be in Irak, it's their neighbour and there're ethnic Turks minority who we have to secure. Also we have to protect our borders. We have to watch for PKK terrorists. We don't have the luxury of living far away from the sick country. Your war brings us alot of headache!! Hence why the movie Valley Of The Wolves: Irak.

You? As in me? I didn't do anything. I don't support this war, and my state had the popular vote against Bush both times, along with the rest of New England. Though I think New Hampshire went red at one of the elections.

Well you as a human, no, I mean all of you as the citizens of USA.
During the wedding of my aunt in France, one of the guests was an American from Chicago, it was back in 2002 I think. He was all against his new president. btw I will never forget him because he was such friendly person. He even invited me in the States (but I still not went) So you remind me of him. There're good people in the USA, I just wonder what make them not flee, when they have no say in their own country.


All Americans are proud of our country, just not the current adminstration. Seems like Americans are different from Turkey if your going to ask that question. All of us Americans have different ideas on how the country should work. We all are very individualistic. We usually disagree with each other and in bad times we band together. Even today the North and South have alittle animosity towards each other(more so the south).

Turkish public have very strong opinions. e.g. vote is not an obligation (unlike in Belgium), however the majority feels concerned enough to vote and the political debate is very alive, in everyday discussions as well as on political debates on TV. It's a more democratic country then people think. As an individual you have to follow rules, like you may not belitting the country in the press, and I'm thinking of writer Orhan Pamuk. His book was never a problem, but it became a problem when he said things to a foreign (Swiss?) media that are concidered to be 'belitting', however the citizens as a whole have a strong voice and the government cannot do anything against them. These laws come from the  real state and that is the generals. The military institution is sacred, like some sort of Pharaonic Kingdom. But politicians are seen like the servants of democraty and not more. Never will there be a prime minister that behaves like he can do anything against the citizen's approval.

I think Turks are less individualistic most Western nations. And I hope we can retain that because I see it as a quality. For instance Turkish soldiers are seen as a reference even in the United States because they deeply care of eachother more then themselves. In daily lives it's also important because you won't see that many lonely people you see in Belgium.
I feel very sad for the lonely women and men in Belgium but no one sees it and it's concidered 'normal'. I don't concider it as natural because I have the Turkish reference. Turkishness is about honnour, proudness but also humanity.


See I really don't agree with Bush and his Iraq War, while Akolouthos agrees with Bush, though I don't know if he really supports the war. Yet both of us are very proud to be Americans even though we have different ideas.

--
 I'm not suffering, and by not paying taxes means I lose everything I have. And if you say, "Then why not just move out of the country", then that means I can never help turn things around here. I don't give up that easily and call it quits, that'd be just un-American.

--

That would be a Embarrassment. It means I'd put my tail between my legs and run away(I don't have a tail, just a saying). Our forefathers fought in the Revolution against one of the Greatest Powers of the times, and they won for fighting in what they believed in. I'm not going to start a war aginst my own country, unless Bush decides not to leave office in 2008.  But I'm also not going to agree with the current adminstration, and I hope to see change in the government one day.

How about the refugees who flee to US, like the Jews, they had no choice because it got so bad in Europe for them. That's not a shame. What about Europeans who flee to the US in the last 30 years,  why didn't they try to make things better in Europe? Yet now Americans they would like to make things better. It's like their 'promised land' or something. I'm talking about refugees, because US gave them a chance to live in piece, and in case of the Jews the US saved their existence. But the others, apart from the decendents of the slaves and native Americans (including a native community of Turkish origins), didn't they at one time not turn their back to their country?

I know there're also Turks in the US that who're also making part of the American culture, like the head of Universal, as the head of Coca Cola International. The US gave them the chance to be successfull at international level.

The historical country of exile for Europeans is not USA, it is Turkey.
However, Turkey is not perfect, and this is why it wants to join the EU; It's like a hygienic treatment. And if in the end Turkey doesn't join the EU, it will have had the reforms and the basis for stability and a bright future, and it will have won in the end. It's a win-win situation!
Turkey will again be the shiny star that captures the envy and imaginations the world over.  We've not been the 'shiny star' for some time, but Turks didn't loose their honnour because they stayed independent. We earned our sovereignty ourselves. Our proudness is not volatile nor superficial.

 I'd rather they be called Americans. My kids will grow up to be honorable New Englanders. They will vote for whats right and maybe help make good changes in this country one day. And if they vote for politics I don't agree with, I'll send them to Turkey.

I respect that you want your kids to be called Americans and grow up to be honnorable New Englanders. People like you will save the US. However what can you do now? If the US nukes Iran the damage will stay forever. You live confortably far away, but these people will have their land contaminated and don't forget that Iranians are people of honnours. Ottomans were never able to rule over Persia!

There's an American community in Turkey who concider it as their second home. I think Turks and Americans can go along real good, and perhaps better then with Western Europeans whom I find tend to be pretentious. I don't have 100% Turkish blood, and my European famaliy don't really care for my Turkishness, yet in Turkey people ask me alot of questions with their curious eyes. In my mind, Americans are more like that.  They like new things. For instance they let the Turkish community in New York have their Turkish Day Parade. That's near to impossible in Europe! Here we generally look down to immigrants. Not in USA and not in Turkey.

APRIL 23 National Sovereignty & Children's day: peace at home, peace in the world.


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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Apr-2006 at 05:01
Originally posted by cattus

Speaking of buttons.. Leonardo, use the quote button or use the
code. And please kill the colors, its hard to read!

 


Okay, but forgive my last post as I just read this.

Edit: Eventhough I'm quite busy, I gave a grand demonstration of humility and removed all red colour for your eyes' pleasure.
Now perhaps this thread should be given back to Iranian4Life as it's his and it directly concerns him, being an Iranian living in the US.

I share concern with him and hope US will regain its reasons and won't attack Iran, especially not using NUKES!


Edited by LeonardoTurco
APRIL 23 National Sovereignty & Children's day: peace at home, peace in the world.


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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Apr-2006 at 05:32
Originally posted by Iranian41ife

omg! bush is officially crazy! i just heard on the news that he was quoted as saying that he will be the only president now and in the future to ever have the courage to "save" iran.

mr. bush, you think you can save iran by nuking it? there is something big going on right now, we just have to wait and see what it is, but now im mroe convinced that htis bush administration has huge plans in mind, and WWIII could be closer than we imagine.




APRIL 23 National Sovereignty & Children's day: peace at home, peace in the world.


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  Quote LeonardoTurco Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Apr-2006 at 05:43
Originally posted by Akolouthos

By the way, excuse me, but I will not stand idly by while you charge me with being a racist. If you can't brook rational disagreement then I'm afraid you are in the wrong forum.



I was talking sincerily, but you think of Turks as some kind of barbar, so when I tell you Turks are interested in culture around the world, you mock that by putting 'culture' in parentheses and continue by 'when they don't occupy strategic land'. That's mocking and actually racist but you don't realise that, it's not about brooking rational disagreement rather it is you insulting me and the whole Turkish population at large, who are a honnorable people and don't deserve your pretentious disgrace. Do you want me to going down my knees and just accept that?


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APRIL 23 National Sovereignty & Children's day: peace at home, peace in the world.


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  Quote docyabut Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10-Apr-2006 at 08:49

I think the US would be damed if they do and damed if they don`t . So what if Iran does gets the bomb with the  promise of wiping Isreal off the map, with this suicide bombing idealogy that seems to be a way of war now days.  What would happen  is once a atomic bomb is launched at Isreal  they would launched theirs, destroying millions of people, all the surrounding countires and the world  be affected.   All a  middle eastern country needs is to have a sucide bomber behind a atomic bomb in this world, what is better the chance of saving millions of  people from  dying,and starting WW3, or just to go in a bomb the site and come out with a bad opinion?

 (Robert Blake ) the only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for goog men to do nothing.

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