Notice: This is the official website of the All Empires History Community (Reg. 10 Feb 2002)

  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Register Register  Login Login

Relationship bw Bulgar and Iranian Langua
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 234
Author
  Share Topic Share Topic  Topic Search Topic Search  Topic Options Topic Options
bg_turk View Drop Down
Sultan
Sultan
Avatar

Joined: 28-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2347 		  Quote bg_turk Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Relationship bw Bulgar and Iranian Langua
    Posted: 13-May-2006 at 10:00

Originally posted by Zagros

Ezhdeha means dragon in Persian. Th zh sound being equivalent to the J in French "Jaques", I don't believe the sound exists in Turkish, correct me if I am wrong.

In fact it does and it is written in the same exact way - "j".

The english "j" -  is spelled as "c".
http://www.journalof911studies.com
Back to Top
Socrates View Drop Down
Baron
Baron
Avatar

Joined: 12-Nov-2005
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 416 		  Quote Socrates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-May-2006 at 07:53
Originally posted by tsar

Socrates mate ...... the bulgarians do not have much to do with mediteranian people who were already living there. In south eastern and eastern bulgaria yeh there might be more mediteranian influence.

But amongst the Bulgarians the dominant gene is EU7 ..... Germany has the largest percentage of EU7 (37.5%).... and clearly influence in germany is not mediteranian .......the that suggests that serbs, bulgarians, croats are more arayan than slavic which i dont beleive   .....

we also have 12% of the HG3 wchich is most comman in poland.

we dont even look mediteranian,mediteranians have darker skin than us.

 

I dont know exactly what EU7 is its a different mark then HG-I think its some sort of combination- but I dont know the detailsHowever, I know that germans are 40 % (more or less) HG1 which is native to europe (dating back to paleolithic) which means its not brought by IEs and theyre about 30 % HG3 which is IE marker. Your aryan marker is HG3 according to that, serbs and bulgarians are only about 10-20 % - the greatest european aryans being the poles with 50 %.And aryan is not the same as indo-european aryans are indo-iranians (subgroup of IE) it referes to the people speaking persian, pashto, sanskrit etc. The term was used to label white race by some 19th century racists and later was adopted by the nazisSo however do you look at it, germans are not aryans- linguistically, genetically, or in any other aspect.

 

And the bulgarians also have about 20 % of HG 21 and qbout 10 % of HG 9 which are common in mediteranian countries but its present almost in all european countries like in holland, france, italy, germany,england, chech republicWe serbs have got about 15 % of HG 21 and about 5 % of HG 9Anyway, all this means practically nothing, as I said earlier. I mean, if someone is HG1 he could be turkish, norwegian, lithuanian, frenchJust because two people have, lets say about 60 % of genes in common, it doesnt mean that they share the same or even similar appearance

 

And this is rather confusing:

 

that suggests that serbs, bulgarians, croats are more arayan than slavic

 

It seems like youre under the influence of nazi propaganda...aryan (indo-european) marker is probably HG3-which is found in the highest frequencies at poles, russians, white russians, czechs, slovenians...its not exclusively german and it didnt originate from them.

 

Btw, mediteranians dont have to be darker.They can even be blond.Besides, Coon says that atlanto - mediteranian subrace is significant in bulgaria.These are examples of atl-med:

 

http://www.snpa.nordish.net/troeplate24.htm

 

http://www.snpa.nordish.net/troeplate23.htm
"It's better to be a billionair for a lifetime then to live in poverty for a week"
               Bob Rock
Back to Top
Zagros View Drop Down
Emperor
Emperor

Suspended

Joined: 11-Aug-2004
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 8792 		  Quote Zagros Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17-May-2006 at 08:42
Originally posted by bg_turk

Originally posted by Zagros

Ezhdeha means dragon in Persian. Th zh sound being equivalent to the J in French "Jaques", I don't believe the sound exists in Turkish, correct me if I am wrong.

In fact it does and it is written in the same exact way - "j".

The english "j" -  is spelled as "c".

 
I of the c/j sound, it is not the like zh which I am speaking of, that is why I made the distinction by citing the pronunciation of "Jaques", the J in "Jaques" does not make the j/c sound.
Back to Top
Bulldog View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 17-May-2006
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2006 at 10:20
Apparently there are a million Turks in Bulgaria, are these descendants of the Central Asian Bulgar's?
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
Albert Pine

Back to Top
barbar View Drop Down
General
General
Avatar
retired AE Moderator

Joined: 10-Aug-2005
Location: Italy
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 781 		  Quote barbar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2006 at 12:19
 
I think they are the ottoman decendants (migrants).  Central Asian Bulghars had already integrated into Slavian stock by then.
 
 
 
 
 
Either make a history or become a history.
Back to Top
blue View Drop Down
Janissary
Janissary
Avatar

Joined: 02-Jan-2006
Location: Bulgaria
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 28 		  Quote blue Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18-May-2006 at 13:26
Originally posted by Bulldog

Apparently there are a million Turks in Bulgaria, are these descendants of the Central Asian Bulgar's?
Well the number of Turks in Bulgaria according to the 2001 census is around 747000
They are descendants of the ottoman migrants that had setteled in the Balkans. 
Back to Top
tsar View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai

Suspended

Joined: 12-May-2006
Location: Bulgaria
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 132 		  Quote tsar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2006 at 20:11

Originally posted by socrates

I dont know exactly what EU7 is its a different mark then HG-I think its some sort of combination- but I dont know the detailsHowever, I know that germans are 40 % (more or less) HG1 which is native to europe (dating back to paleolithic) which means its not brought by IEs and theyre about 30 % HG3 which is IE marker. Your aryan marker is HG3 according to that, serbs and bulgarians are only about 10-20 % - the greatest european aryans being the poles with 50 %.And aryan is not the same as indo-european aryans are indo-iranians (subgroup of IE) it referes to the people speaking persian, pashto, sanskrit etc. The term was used to label white race by some 19th century racists and later was adopted by the nazisSo however do you look at it, germans are not aryans- linguistically, genetically, or in any other aspect.



And the bulgarians also have about 20 % of HG 21 and qbout 10 % of HG 9 which are common in mediteranian countries but its present almost in all european countries like in holland, france, italy, germany,england, chech republicWe serbs have got about 15 % of HG 21 and about 5 % of HG 9Anyway, all this means practically nothing, as I said earlier. I mean, if someone is HG1 he could be turkish, norwegian, lithuanian, frenchJust because two people have, lets say about 60 % of genes in common, it doesnt mean that they share the same or even similar appearance



And this is rather confusing:



that suggests that serbs, bulgarians, croats are more arayan than slavic



It seems like youre under the influence of nazi propaganda...aryan (indo-european) marker is probably HG3-which is found in the highest frequencies at poles, russians, white russians, czechs, slovenians...its not exclusively german and it didnt originate from them.



Btw, mediteranians dont have to be darker.They can even be blond.Besides, Coon says that atlanto - mediteranian subrace is significant in bulgaria.These are examples of atl-med:



http://www.snpa.nordish.net/troeplate24.htm



http://www.snpa.nordish.net/troeplate23.htm






   The whole population needs to be tested to find out what we really are
And yeh I didnt know what i was typing when i said mediteranean are darker people ...... LOL


    
    

Edited by tsar - 19-May-2006 at 20:13
Back to Top
tsar View Drop Down
Samurai
Samurai

Suspended

Joined: 12-May-2006
Location: Bulgaria
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 132 		  Quote tsar Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19-May-2006 at 20:15
Originally posted by Bulldog

Apparently there are a million Turks in Bulgaria, are these descendants of the Central Asian Bulgar's?

    Ottoman descendants mate ottoman
Back to Top
Anton View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph


Joined: 23-Jun-2006
Location: Bulgaria
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2888 		  Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 09:25
Originally posted by tsar

Originally posted by the Bulgarian

I don't know why blue and Bulgarian Soldja insist so much on not having anything to do with the Volga Bulgars as if they were ashamed of it. What's the matter with you two, they are owr relatives, grandsons and granddaughters of owr own grandfathers - the Bulgars. Which clearly makes them family, well at least genetically. On the other hand we haven't interacted with them for 1300 years and owr cultures are totally different. But still, we have common blood running through owr veins.

Why be ashamed of the Volga Bulgars and Bulgars, they were great people, great warriors. They were also taller than Europeans wen they came, their average height was 175m and were physically very strong. While the rest of Europeans measured an average height of 160m

Little is left of our Bulgar ancestors in the Bulgarian population today though.

 
 
I also don't understand why should we be ashamed of Volga Bulgars. But their Turk origins are also questioned nowadays. For example I remember that they were called Sacalibi (Slavs) by Ibn Fadlan who was there. And thus, they could be something different at the beggining and then were turkisized like Balcan Bulgarians slavisized


Edited by Anton - 27-Jun-2006 at 09:25
Back to Top
Bulldog View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph
Avatar

Joined: 17-May-2006
Location: United Kingdom
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2800 		  Quote Bulldog Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 10:49

You should read Ibn Fadlan a bit closer because such a confusion is not made.

Bulgarians should be proud of Volga Bulgars, its where their name derives from for goodness sake, you cannot deny history just because you don't like to admit the ancestors of your nation's name were Turkic. Let's face it that's the only problem you have with it, if they were Slav's you'd be singing out loud with pride about the Volga Bulgars Big smile
      What we do for ourselves dies with us. What we do for others and the world remains and is immortal.
Albert Pine

Back to Top
Anton View Drop Down
Caliph
Caliph


Joined: 23-Jun-2006
Location: Bulgaria
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 2888 		  Quote Anton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27-Jun-2006 at 11:29
Originally posted by Bulldog

Bulgarians should be proud of Volga Bulgars, its where their name derives from for goodness sake, you cannot deny history just because you don't like to admit the ancestors of your nation's name were Turkic. Let's face it that's the only problem you have with it, if they were Slav's you'd be singing out loud with pride about the Volga Bulgars Big smile

 
 
 
 
It seems, buddy, that you knows better what we think and what we like  :) We singing out loud with pride about the Volga Bulgars for a long time, you just missed this.


Edited by Anton - 27-Jun-2006 at 18:43
Back to Top
NikeBG View Drop Down
Colonel
Colonel


Joined: 04-Jan-2006
Online Status: Offline
Posts: 529 		  Quote NikeBG Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15-Jul-2006 at 05:40
Oh, hot-doggie, you're back? Or I'm back actually. Just for a short visit...

Btw, you're right - Anton should've read Ibn Fadlan more thoroughly! Indeed he mentions the Sakaliba, which some reseachers connect with the Slavs. But he mentions the Bulgars separately from them, just as he mention the Turkic people separately from the Bulgars. Smile
And we do feel proud with our distant cousins. Distant, because, after all, we were Slavicized and they haven't. Although we're all using our alphabet! Wink But we don't speak so much about them, as (alas) our information about them is pretty scarce. Those Russians are still calling them Tatars and till the recent past they wouldn't let any word about them reach us! But now we're ready to make up for the lost time... Smile
Oh, and the name Bulgars doesn't derive from Volga, which was called Itil back then. And, afaik, neither does the name Volga derive from Bulgar, although that might actually be just Russian information...
Back to Top
Guests View Drop Down
Guest
Guest
  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06-Jan-2009 at 11:28
Good topic. Btw, you're right - Anton should've read Ibn Fadlan more thoroughly! Indeed he mentions the Sakaliba, which some reseachers connect with the Slavs.
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply Page  <1 234

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Bulletin Board Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 9.56a [Free Express Edition]
Copyright ©2001-2009 Web Wiz

This page was generated in 0.125 seconds.