The Pomak Language - a Bulgarian dialect?

In another thread the Pomak dialect was brought into discussion so not to diverge from the topic I open this new thread:

Originally posted by Yiannis If the Pomak language is spoken, then it must have a certain syntax and grammar attached to it, no? The only thing missing would be to write it down.   1. Kak to zavot? Orh�n: M�ne mo zav�t Orh�n. T�be kak to zav�t? Hilmiy�: M�ne mo zav�t Hilmiy�. Orh�n:  At kad� si? Hilmiy�: At Brat�nkovo. T� at kad� si? Orh�n: Ya som at S�dnovitso. �mash li dr�g� br�tye? Hilmiy�: �mom ann� s�stro i dvam�na br�tie. Orh�n: Ya �mom le ann�k br�ta y�shte. Hilmiy�: K�lko si god�n�? Orh�n: Ye som na on-dok�s. T� na k�lku si? Hilmiy�: Ya som na on-yed�. Orh�n: Znosh li da d�mish Ur�mtsk�i? Hilmiy�: Na znom y�tse h�be. T�? Orh�n: Ya znom h�be. Kak zav�t bub�ykati? Hilmiy�: Zav�t go  Huse�n. Dakt�r ye faf Isk�che. T�be bub�ykoti kakv� r�bato pr�i? Orh�n: R�bati na vap�rieno. T�i ye is� na Am�riko. Hilmiy�: Va, in�lkos dal�che ye! Kog� she si d�ide? Orh�n: Za tri m�sets�. Hilmiy�: Y�tse h�be. It�i sme. She d�mime pak. Orh�n: She d�mime. Zh�vi i zdr�vi! Hilmiy�: Zh�vi i zdr�vi! http://pomakdictionary.tripod.com/index/id10.html

LOL, this was so funny.

Orhan asks how old are you, in Bulgarian.
And then Hilmiye replies 'on-dokus' in Turkish. I really did not know pomaks counted in Turkish. 
Most of the Pomaks I know speak pure Bulgarian, mostly due to the assimilation, I suppose their language was better preserved in Greece.

'bubaykati' I suppose means "your father". In my Turkish dialect it is 'buba', in
Turkish 'baba'.

'urumutski' should mean Greek. It is Rumca in Turkish. But Turks from Rumelia tend to invert the letter ordering when they start with 'r'. examples:
Turkish  ->  BG_Turkish = EN
-------------------------------------
Rumeli -> Urmeli = Rumelia
ruya -> urya = Dream
ruba -> urba = Clothe


Apparently Pomaks do the same. So they have changed Rumtski to Urumtski.

But questions that spring to mind are ...
Why is it in Latin, and not in Cyrillic? Wouldn't it be natural for Greeks to impose Cyrillic as the alphabet of the Pomak language, since it is closer to their own?

By the way I can feel how Charge will drop on us like a ton of bricks for the invention of the "Pomak language" as if the "Macedonian language" is not enough.
 



Edited by bg_turk - 17-Jun-2006 at 09:22

Hello NikeBG and bg_turk

Don't forget that the Pomak language has many Greek words.

Yeah, there are many words of pure greek origin (many of them related to the ancient greek forms), so it is believed that they are unlikely to be simple loans and some believe that the pomak language was an ancient greek dialect that was heavily fluenced by foreign languages.

Originally posted by bg_turk Orhan asks how old are you, in Bulgarian. And then Hilmiye replies 'on-dokus' in Turkish. I really did not know pomaks counted in Turkish.

Well - that`s all - the pomaks in Greece speaks bulgarian language, but with some turkish and greek words. I also use turkish and greek words, when i speak.

Originally posted by bg_turk Most of the Pomaks I know speak pure Bulgarian, mostly due to the assimilation, I suppose their language was better preserved in Greece.

"mostly due to the assimilation"?  This sounds really funny.   ===>   Bulgarians, assimilated (by other bulgarians) to bulgarians.

Well, they are muslims and they counted in turkish as a result of the turkish-islamic assimilation in the time of the turkish rule in the Balkans.

Thanks for the list Dorian, but most of the words on this list as Charge noted also exist in Bulgarian and Macedonian so they do not prove any link of the language spoken by Pomaks to Greek. (some even exist in Turkish - kanonlo (kanunlu), kufina(kufa), lahna).

PS. Could you please provide the source from where you pasted the list?

Tangrism is still a living religion I think? by some Turkic people's in North Eastern Russian remote regions.

Its great to see more Bulgarians starting to explore their past and put the prejeduce and lies that have sadly been promoted aside.

 

I didn't copy-paste it. I just looked through a small list of pomak words and their translation in english, and I found which of these words derive from greek words.

there are some words in greek that are not I/E, but are assumed to be pre-I/E. Would that preculde them from being greek? In my mind no, but that may have to be clarified before any test.