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First World War.
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Winterhaze13 View Drop Down
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Posts: 716 		  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: First World War.
    Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:08
I think that the origins of the First World War is one of the most fascinating debates it history. Many historian such as Fritz Fischer believe that German was completely at fault, I do not share this opinion. I believe that no one country can be completely at fault, Russia and Austria-Hungary did the most to provoke this war, and that the others were trying to protect their interests. For example, Germany was looking out for their only real ally Austria, while also trying to protect their best interests on the continent. Which is a valid defence, every country looks out for their best interests. What do you guys think?
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Posts: 4310 		  Quote Tobodai Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:16
Some peopel argue that no one should be blamed, that the participants were swept up in a system of their own creation, I beleive they are ALL to blame, for creating the very conditiosn where that could happen.
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Posts: 716 		  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 13:34
Does anyone out there claim Germany is completely responsible?
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Posts: 339 		  Quote Kubrat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 11-Nov-2004 at 20:13
They are all to blame.  Their greed is what sparked the war, greed for power and dominance.

And of course, every country has this, so .....
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 07:48
The only belligerent country of WW1 that is not responsible is Belgium.
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Posts: 2656 		  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 14:22
I blame the Kaiser personally, and his advisors, for creating such a dangerous situation, and Austria-Hungary for then throwing the match on the German powder keg.  However, I think Fischer's assessment is a little harsh.
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 15:24
which Kaiser?
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Posts: 1988 		  Quote TheDiplomat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 15:37

Originally posted by Temujin

which Kaiser?

Gengish mentions about Willhelm II i guess...

 
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Posts: 1988 		  Quote TheDiplomat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 15:42

Originally posted by MixcoatlToltecahtecuhtli

The only belligerent country of WW1 that is not responsible is Belgium.

Also pal,The Ottoman Empire itself was not responsible...it just wished to survive.

But the fight about  how to share the lands of othe Ottoman Empire,its oil sources and the russian centuries dream of Istanbul and bosphoros among imperialistic powers wre major reasons of  the first world war.
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Posts: 2656 		  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 19:11
Yeah, I mean Kaiser Wilhelm II.
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 19:14
yeah, but he was not alone....
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Posts: 2656 		  Quote Genghis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 19:58
I said his advisors as well, especially the list of bad chancellors like Caprivi.
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Posts: 1803 		  Quote cattus Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 20:00
Count Von Berchtold, a great contributor.
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Posts: 339 		  Quote Kubrat Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12-Nov-2004 at 22:58

Also pal,The Ottoman Empire itself was not responsible...it just wished to survive.

But the fight about  how to share the lands of othe Ottoman Empire,its oil sources and the russian centuries dream of Istanbul and bosphoros among imperialistic powers wre major reasons of  the first world war.


Yes, but the Ottoman Empire was promised some of its lost territory back right?  So it wasn't that innocent.

Just like Bulgaria was promised Macedonia (and Tzar Ferdinand got paid 20,000,000 DM).
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Posts: 716 		  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 08:58
I think we are forgetting the Russians, although this is widely disputed it is possible that the Russian announced their complete support for Serbia in private before Germany announced their unconditional support to Austria-Hungary. I think Russia's role in the July Crisis is underrepresented in History.
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  Quote Guests Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 10:59
Also pal,The Ottoman Empire itself was not responsible...it just wished to survive.

But the fight about  how to share the lands of othe Ottoman Empire,its oil sources and the russian centuries dream of Istanbul and bosphoros among imperialistic powers wre major reasons of  the first world war.

It was the Ottoman Empire itself that declared war on the allies, and eventually they lost. So the Ottoman Empire didn't survive because they went into WW1.
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 12:13

Originally posted by Genghis

I said his advisors as well, especially the list of bad chancellors like Caprivi.

 

I mean he was not alone in Europe...
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Winterhaze13 View Drop Down
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Posts: 716 		  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 12:47
In 1914, Germany and Russia were the most imperialistic. Germany with Realpolitik and Russia had fought in the Russo-Japanese war for territorial gain. While, France and Germany were probably the most aggressive. However, Austria-Hungary's failure to localize the conflict is what probably provoked the Great War. Does anyone think that something could have been done to prevent the outbreak of war? If Germany stepped aside causiously that may have prevented it, Russia also.
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Posts: 5221 		  Quote Temujin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 13:00

Bismarck practised Realpolitik, not Wilhelm.

KuK dragged in Germany, Russia dragged in France and, together with the entry of Germany, Britain.
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Winterhaze13 View Drop Down
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Posts: 716 		  Quote Winterhaze13 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13-Nov-2004 at 13:14
No you are mistaken, Bismarck reconsidered colonies, which was one of the reasons for his falling out with Kaiser Wilhelm. After 1871, Bismarck became the conservative Chancellor. I think I have confused people, Realpolitik means means politics of "reason", I mean Wilpolitik which means "world policy" in German. I am afraid this policy refers to Kaiser Wilhelm's crusade to establish Germany as a major colonial power.

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