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Huncuk
Knight
Joined: 17-Dec-2006
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Topic: Are the Tatars Turk or Mongol? Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 21:31 |
Turks are 5000years old race =).
Well,the tatars of Xianbei was Mongol,but they all slaughtered by Ghengis.
Tatars of Ghengis army and today are all Turkic named Tatar.They are ethnicly Kipchak and Karabulghar Turks.
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omergun
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 17:04 |
Originally posted by Leonidas
Turkish = people assoc with turkey
Turkic is is much more accurate as it is linguistic/cultural based description of the broader group including (but not limited to) turkey.
Its a small but important detail one should be mindful of.
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No, dividing these two terms, is nothing else than a imaginary variaton made on purpose. All Trks are the same and they are called Trks, either they live in Trkiye, Central, Middle, East, West, North Asia, Balkans or East Europe. Making such variatons based on English language is ridiculous. Look at how all those Trks everywhere think about who they are, then youll understand. For example, you can call someone in Kazakistan a Kazak, or someone in Azerbaycan a Azeri, but its not right to say they are Trkic, Trkish or another variaton used, they are all Trks.
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ATTİLA
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Guests
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 07:27 |
uzbeks-tatars-karakalpaks-azeries-kazaks-tuvas-sakas(yakutistan)-kırım turks(avars and tatars)-gagavuz(gokoguz)-oguz turks(turkies turks)-ahıska-nokaies-some of bulgars and onoguz(macars)[macar and bulgars had mixed with slavs and other people] but tatars are in turk-mongol fenotype but in turkish genotype...
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Guests
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 07:26 |
uzbeks-tatars-karakalpaks-azeries-kazaks-tuvas-sakas(yakutistan)-kırım turks(avars and tatars)-gagavuz(gokoguz)-oguz turks(turkies turks)-ahıska-nokaies-some of bulgars and onoguz(macars)[macar and bulgars had mixed with slavs and other people] but tatars turk-mongol are in fenotype but in turkish genotype...
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EGETRK
Consul
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 05:21 |
i dont use ''turkish'' word...İt separeate Trk world from Trks of Trkiye
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The lands of the of the West may be armored with walls of steel,
But I have borders guarded by the mighty chest of a believer...
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Leonidas
Tsar
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 05:12 |
Turkish = people assoc with turkey
Turkic is is much more accurate as it is linguistic/cultural based description of the broader group including (but not limited to) turkey.
Its a small but important detail one should be mindful of.
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GrandTurk
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 03:50 |
This is not true.
Also please remember that first country who used Turk word is Gk Trk in 630.
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"If you wanna taste the war,you should fight with Turks" English General
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ephestion
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 02:29 |
No they are not Turksih. Turkey or Turkish exists post 1926.
They are not Ottoman either they were a Tripartite alliance of Arab, Persian and Turkomen.
Tartars are one of many tribes that contributed to the formation of the Turkish speaking people along with Mongolians. They were re-turked post 1000AD during the Mongolian invasion which re-spread and scattered the Turks in places they normally didnt exist. The reason being they were traditionally hired as Mercenaries na dserved in some of the most disrespected armies of history Hun, Mongols and so forth.
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GrandTurk
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Posted: 17-Dec-2006 at 01:24 |
I have been to Tataristan many times.
They are Turkish!
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"If you wanna taste the war,you should fight with Turks" English General
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Urungu Han
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Posted: 11-Aug-2006 at 06:02 |
I have a research from Prof.Dr.R.Trkkan about Tatar Turks.I wil write it later to finish this topic.
And remember,Tatar heads are brakisefal =)
Edited by Urungu Han - 12-Aug-2006 at 07:32
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Urungu Han
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Posted: 10-Aug-2006 at 03:53 |
Originally posted by Imperator Invictus
No, I think you're getting the usage confused. The original "Tatars" north of China cannot be used to apply to modern Tatars.
The original Tatars were unlikely to have been Turkic. They lived in a region populated with Mongolic and Tungusic peoples, and had many similarities to Chingiz Khan's tribe.
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I said two different nations friend.Your opinion is only a theory,my opinion is too.
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bg_turk
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Posted: 09-Aug-2006 at 22:45 |
I have met Volga Tatars and Crimean Tatars, and I could totally understand them when they spoke.
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Master_Blaster
Pretorian
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Posted: 09-Aug-2006 at 20:33 |
The original "Ta-ta" were from Mongolia and may have been either Mongol or Turkic, they were either incorporated into Genghis Khan's Mongol Horde or fled his onslaught and became refugees, eventually conquering Central Asia and settling there. The Tatars of Tatarstan adopted their name and customs.
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Imperator Invictus
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Posted: 09-Aug-2006 at 11:03 |
No, I think you're getting the usage confused. The original "Tatars" north of China cannot be used to apply to modern Tatars.
The original Tatars were unlikely to have been Turkic. They lived in a region populated with Mongolic and Tungusic peoples, and had many similarities to Chingiz Khan's tribe.
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Urungu Han
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Posted: 09-Aug-2006 at 08:14 |
Originally posted by axeman
the Tatars were originally Mongol tribe which became virtually extinct in civil war back in 13th century in Mongolia. Then Mongols came to Europe, everyone called them Tatars. Today Tatars in Russia are Turkic by language and mixture of Volga Bulgarians, Kipchaks and other tribes.
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Tatars weren't a mongol tribe.
There are two nations called tata.
Tatar Turks were gone to china in Proto-Turkic time in Turkish History.
"Tata" means Turkish in oldest chinese,and "-ar,er"additions means disbanded(dağılmış) in old Turkish.İt became Tatar.Tatars were a old Turkis Tribe,not young.
Some historians have theorys about Tatar Turks(but all of them are mongol =).They say Tatars were originally mongol.But a Tatar tribe in Turkey(now,they are battling with PKK kurds in mountains) called an Turkish antrologist,he researched and say that thay are Turkis(and sorry for my poor english =).
Tatars are originally Turkic friends.They mixed like other tribes but they are still Turkic.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 21:59 |
Kazan or Qazan is recognized by the Russian Federation as the administrative capital of the Republic of Tatarstan, the current president is Mintimer Shaeymiev and the current prime minister is Rustam Minnikhanov.
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Omar al Hashim
King
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 21:52 |
Tataristans captial was/is Kazan. I'm not sure if this is in anyway recognised by the Russians.
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Master_Blaster
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 20:31 |
The Tatars of the Crimea (in the Ukraine) and of Tatarstan (in the Russian Federation) are definitely not Mongols. They are are Turkic people of Caucasian stock who adopted the name, customs, culture, and language of their conqerors.
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ok ge
Arch Duke
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 20:15 |
I cannot recall where did I read this before. However, I remember the term Tatar is the inhabitant of Western steppes who were Bulgar Turks and were mixed with invading Mongols to form the Tartar notion. Is this true? Not 100% sure.
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D.J. Kaufman
Wisdom is the reward for a lifetime of listening ... when youd have preferred to talk.
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Anton
Caliph
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Posted: 08-Aug-2006 at 17:24 |
Originally posted by xi_tujue
there still is its a aunotmomus region in siberia but thats not the same as krim tatars |
Tatarstan is not in Siberia. Not all Russia is Siberia
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